ShivBaba's incarnation

[new world]

Andrey Bhai, what do you mean by internal external? Our Purushaarth (efforts), Gyan, dharna, Yoga all are internal. And even if there is internal external in Brahmin world, internally & externally the Brahmin community is occupied by Brahma's night. Also the idea of 'internally Brahma's day & externally Brahma's night' cannot be proved by Murli points.

Again a Murli point quotes that when the sun (of knowledge) is caught by an eclipse, he gets free fron that eclipse by Swa-darshan Chakra' (I'll quote the exact wording & date of Murli after 2 days as I am outdoor). Brahma's night is that period when the Sun of Knowledge is caught by an eclipse. He practises his incorporeal stage & Swa-darshan to be free from that eclipse. So during Brahma's night the Sun of Knowledge cannot give his light due to eclipse.

But now today there is 'behad kee Amritwela' that is, last period of Brahma's night. During Amrit Vela we can see the lightened sky in the east & we can easily guess that the sun will rise soon. Shmilarly during 'behad kee Amrit Vela' i.e., at the last period of the Brahma's night, we can have feeling of very very deem light of knowledge from the Sun of Knowledge even though he has not risen yet.

[andrey]

Dear brother,

The sun cannot be eclipsed. It is the earth that is eclipsed. Sun is a ball of fire and no shadow can be cast on it. If you throw dirt to it it will come back to you. It is the moon or some other planet (can be seen passing before the sun) that comes in between the sun and the earth and casts his shadow on earth, and hides the sun from the eyes of people living on earth. This means in the soul, that is the earth, there is the influence of the soul that is the moon, (or other soul) and the influence of the sun is hidden which happens on rare occasions in the outside world. Then when the earth comes in between the sun and the moon, it casts its shadow on the moon that happens every month. It does not happen that when the soul of Krishna enters the body of the soul of Ram, he "eclipses" his stage, rather he himself (the soul of Krishna) under the influence of the colour of the company adopts a seed-like stage.

[arjun]

Dear brother new_world,

Om Shanti. As regards the eclipse of Sun (of knowledge) ShivBaba (through Baba Virendra Dev Dixit) has clarified that it is the temporary misunderstanding of the children that the Sun (of knowledge) gets eclipsed due to their limited intellect. Actually, the Sun of Knowledge cannot be eclipsed by any (living soul-like) planet or its satellite. It is only when we take our eyes off the Sun of Knowledge and start looking at the living planets or satellites of knowledge that we think the Sun of Knowledge has eclipsed.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

[new world]

Andreybhai & Arjunbhai, it's clearly stated in Murli that when the Sun (of Knowledge) gets eclipsed, he gets free from that eclipse by Swa-darshan Chakra. Thus he also does Purushaarth (efforts). He also practises soul-consciousness. If really the Sun (of Knowledge) doesn't get eclipsed then:-

• 1) Why does the material sun gets eclipsed? (The broad drama of 5,000 years repeates in the Confluence Aged drama of 100 years. In the broad drama, the material sun gets eclipsed, and as the shooting of this event, the Sun of Knowledge also gets eclipsed in the Confluence Aged drama),
  2) Why is the Sun of Knowledge also practising soul-consciousness & Swa-darshan Chakra? (If he doesn't get eclipsed, then practise of soul consciousness & Swa-darshan Chakra is not necessary).

And the Murli also supports the fact that the Sun of Knowledge gets eclipsed. Then how can you say that the solar-eclipse is misunderstanding? The clarification through Virendra Dev Dixit goes against the Murli point. As I am outdoors, I'll quote the exact wording & Murli date in 1 or 2 days.

[arjun]

1) Why does the material sun gets eclipsed? (The broad drama of 5,000 years repeates in the Confluence Aged drama of 100 years. In the broad drama, the material sun gets eclipsed, and as the shooting of this event, the Sun of Knowledge also gets eclipsed in the Confluence Aged drama)

It is only when the moon comes in between the Earth and the Sun for some time that the residents of Earth misunderstand that Sun has vanished. But actually the Sun does not vanish anywhere. Similarly, the Sun of Knowledge does not vanish but remains in its position of unshakeable faith on God and on its own part.

2) Why is the Sun of Knowledge also practising soul-consciousness & Swa-darshan Chakra? (If he doesn't get eclipsed, then practise of soul consciousness & Swa-darshan Chakra is not necessary).

The matter of eclipse is not about dharana but about faith and faithlessness. When compared to all the living stars of knowledge the soul of Confluence Aged Ram is like the Polar star. All the stars change their position, i.e. keep losing faith, but the Polar star does not lose faith. And when compared to the various planets and satellites, the soul of Confluence-Aged Ram is like the Sun of Knowledge. All the planets and satellites revolve around the Sun.

The Sun of Knowledge also has to practise soul consciousness because it also gets coloured by the company of sinful souls, but because of the presence of Shiv in him he is able to overcome the effect very soon.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

[new world]

Yes, Arjunbhai, I agree with you that due to the effect of the moon (Brahma), we have the illusion that the Sun of Knowledge is eclipsed. Actually the moon (Brahma) interferes in the cassettes & CDs of Virendra Dev Dixit (the sun). And thus we are misguided (by Brahma) when we listen to these cassettes & CDs. So the role of the moon (Brahma) is to restrict us from getting direct light from Sun of Knowledge. So we have the feeling of solar eclipse. This occures during the night of Brahma.

Now you can say that not Brahma, but the soul of Jagdamba who is instrumental in bringing the illusion of solar eclipse & night of Brahma. Thus Jagdamba (& not Lekhraj Brahma) becomes the moon of knowledge, as only the moon is responsible for the illusion of solar eclipse. But there is only one sun & only one moon. In Murlis the words 'suns' & 'moons' are never used. And if Jagdamba is the moon of knowledge, then Lekhraj Brahma cannot be called as the moon.

According to advance knowledge, Jagdamba is superior to Lekhraj Brahma. Thus the position of Brahma becomes lower to the moon (if Jagdamba is considered as moon). But it's true that the statements of Brahma in Avyakt Vanis are also Shrimat. Now if Brahma's position is lower to the moon, then how can he conduct Avyakt Vanis? No doubt, he is not sun, but to conduct Avyakt Vanis, he must, at least, be the moon of knowledge. Thus Brahma is the moon who creates illusion of the solar eclipse.

And the sun & the moon are in the corporeal world. So to be the moon of knowledge, Brahma must be a corporeal being even after 1969. The sun in the corporeal world & the moon in the Subtle Region - is that logical? Also PBKs argue that the mother & the Father must be corporeal. Then the sun & the moon of knowledge must be corporeal beings even after 1969. Thus the assumption that 'the Brahma has 50 years less' cannot be accepted.

[andrey]

Dear bother new_world,

there are a lot of explanations regarding the day and night of Brahma in vcds 350 and 354. One can see on the site PBKs.info

I was thinking how much we are influenced from what we hear and how little we have thoughts of our own. It is good as long as we are influenced with a good company.

[arjun]

And the sun & the moon are in the corporeal world. So to be the moon of knowledge, Brahma must be a corporeal being even after 1969. The sun in the corporeal world & the moon in the Subtle Region - is that logical? Also PBKs argue that the mother & the Father must be corporeal. Then the sun & the moon of knowledge must be corporeal beings even after 1969. Thus the assumption that 'the Brahma has 50 years less' cannot be accepted

In the advance knowledge it is said that Brahma, i.e. Jagdamba is the actual Moon of knowledge. Dada Lekhraj is the Moon of knowledge in the aadhaarmoort world (base-like world of BKs) whereas Jagdamba is the Moon of knowledge in the beejroopi world (seed-like world of PBKs). Although Brahma Dada Lekhraj may not be in corporeal form, but Jagdamba is in corporeal form now.

You have once again raised the issue of Brahma being present in corporeal form after 1969, but you have not clearly stated about your beliefs as to who is Brahma according to you and if you consider Dada Lekhraj to be Brahma, then whether he has taken rebirth in 1969 or not? If yes, then with which name and form? You stated that another name of advance knowledge is 'confusion'; so I sincerely hope that at least you would not keep us in confusion over Brahma/Dada Lekhraj's rebirth.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

[new world]

Dear Arjunbhai, so there are 2 moons. OK. Then:-

• 1) Give at least one Murli point which clearly proves that there are 2 moons,
  2) Give at least one Murli point which is definitely applicable to the moon of the base world (& not to the moon of the seed world) &
  3) Give at least one Murli point which is definitely applicable to the moon of the seed world (& not to the moon of the base world).

From the concept of 2 moons, do you mean that there are 2 moon dynasties in the Confluence Age? Does Murli support to the concept of 2 moon dynasties in the Confluence Age?

If Jagdamba is the moon of knowledge, then what about Bharatmata? is not she a moon? It is believed that Bharatmata is superior to Lekhraj Brahma but inferior to Jagdamba. Thus her position becomes higher than the moon of base world, but lower than the moon of the seed world. In other words position of Bharatmata is between two moons. In this situation, can we accept Bharatmata as the THIRD moon ... ?

Now suppose that Bharatmata is superior to Jagdamba. Then her position becomes higher than that of the moon of the base world & lower than that of the sun (the Father). In this situation, she cannot be called as the sun, as there is only one sun - the Father of humanity. In this case can we accept her as the THIRD moon ... ?

But 2 moons or 3 moons are only logical derivations. I've never read the word 'moons' in Murlis.

I'll open a new thread about the corporeal role of Lekhraj Brahma after 1969.

[andrey]

Dear brother new_world,

We believe that the Sun of Knowledge, the giver of knowledge is the Supreme Soul Shiva and not the soul of Ram or Prajapita. The soul of Ram can practice his incorporeal stage but the soul of Shiva does not need to practice the incorporeal stage. He resides permanently in this, and does not need learn knowledge and there is no obstacles in him giving the knowledge.

In the Murli it is said that we should think that he is constantly in the Chariot. We believe this soul is ever pure, means cannot be influenced by anything (including the soul of Lekhraj Kirpalani) so there should be no obstacles for us to receive the knowledge from him. Even when this soul used to give knowledge through Brahma Baba, we accept this Murli to be his words, and give regard. There were no obstacles from the soul of Krishna. Why should there be obstacles now?

Please, explain where do you have the ideas that the night of Brahma starts from 1960-61 and that now it is the night of Brahma? Is this from advance knowledge? We believe that day starts from 1976.

[new world]

Andrey Bhai, so you think that my dear than the dearest Baba Virendra Dev Dixit is not the Sun of Knowledge! Then his position becomes inferior to that of the Sun. Then logically we HAVE TO accept that Virendra Dev Dixit is a Moon of Knowledge. Now the total number of Moons of Knowledge becomes 4 as;

• 1) Lekhraj Brahma (moon of base world),
  2) Jagdamba (moon of seed-like world),
  3) Bharatmata (moon of which world?) &
  4) Virendra Dev Dixit - the Father (moon of which world??).

Andrey Bhai, after the entrance of incorporeal Shiva in the Father, he (the Father) achieves 100% incorporeal stage & becomes the Sun of Knowledge (of the corporeal world).[/list]

[andrey]

No, no, there is no such logic. Yes, the supreme Father Shiva is superior to the Father of the people. He is the one who has the knowledge and gives the knowledge. One can become equal to the Sun of Knowledge but not forever.

The part of the moon of knowledge through BB is also played, the knowledge is given by the Sun of Knowledge. One can become moon of knowledge or equal to the moon, one can become star of knowledge, ocean of knowledge is the Supreme Soul Shiva, but one can become equal ocean of knowledge or lake of knowlegde, river of knowledge or pond of knowledge.

[new world]

No logic. Total lack of commonsense. Andrey Bhai, is your reply in accordance with advance knowledge? If the Father of humanity is not the sun, then what is he? - The moon? Or the river? Or the pond of knowledge?

[andrey]

Yes, sorry, you could have been correct, because there is only one Supreme Soul Shive he is called supreme male and when he comes to him the body he comes and the soul inside is female.

I don't know if it is in accordance with the advance knowledge but in some sense one may be also be able to call the soul of the Father as moon of knowledge since he does not have his own light and receive the light of knowledge from the actual Sun of Knowledge, who is this Supreme Soul Shiva the Sun of Knowledge.

However, he imbibes it in such a way that he becomes equal to the Sun of Knowledge, so it can be said that he becomes sun of knwoledge, also equal ocean of knowledge, and also maybe he can be called the living Gyan man sarovar. Sun of Knowledge is also said because of the kind of light he gives (the Supreme Soul Shiva), powerful light, heat, in comparison to the cool light of knowledge given through Brahma Baba.

[arjun]

Om Shanti.

According to the advanced knowledge incorporeal Shiv is compared to the Ocean, while the Father of the humanity is the Sun of Knowledge. Brahma/Jagdamba is the moon of knowledge while the alokik Brahmins are the stars of knowledge.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun