Life stories

[Larena]

I hope you will respect my right to respond on this forum.

I don't limit anybody's rights. Do what you want.


Don't call me sister. You offended me few times already. If you did not heard about the tradition where calling somone sister could be offending, study more and know other culture indeed, by going there and living there. Then maybe you will understand. You could be at least sensistive to this minimun extent that if someone asks you kindly 'don't call me sister' you would respect this request, instead of trying to force him to accept your point of view. But again, Indians who I met suffer from deficiency of empathy. You are an example.

Once again, I DO NOT WISH ANYBODY (YOU TOO) TO CALL ME SISTER. IS IT CLEAR? This is my right.

[arjun]

Once again, I DO NOT WISH ANYBODY (YOU TOO) TO CALL ME Sister. IS IT CLEAR? This is my right.

OK, now that you are talking on legal terms then I will bow to your wishes. I will not call you sister any more. But you will continue to be my sister in my heart. In case you contact me personally through email any time in future, I shall always be available for any help to you as a brother.

Thanks,
OGS,
Arjun

[Larena]

Calling a woman mother or sister is strictly limited to certain situations in Europe. Im my country people can safely call 'sister' only nuns or nurses. 'Mother' (mom) they say only to they own mothers.

I would like to stay self-confident and self-suffcient till my last breath. This is my ideal and my wish for myself. I don't want any more someone to call me mother or sister and to make me handicapped and helpless in life by teaching me that the woman should be surrendered to a man and he should control her.

[arjun]

Calling a woman mother or Sister is strictly limited to certain situations in Europe. Im my country people can safely call 'Sister' only nuns or nurses. 'Mother' (mom) they say only to they own mothers.

I would like to stay self-confident and self-suffcient till my last breath. This is my ideal and my wish for myself. I don't want any more someone to call me mother or Sister and to make me handicapped and helpless in life by teaching me that the woman should be surrendered to a man and he should control her.

Establishing the relationship of a brother or a son with someone does not make anyone handicapped and helpless. This is totally against the concept of universal brotherhood or vasudhaiv kutumbkam (one world family) that has been practiced in India (or any other country) since ages.

I think the cultural differences between India and Europe became an impediment in your continuance in AIVV. Anyway, I will not go into details any further. I am sorry once again for whatever happened to you during your stay in AIVV. I apologize on behalf of all those PBKs who might have caused any kind of harm or pain to you deliberately or unknowingly. I wish you a good future. It is your wish whether you will forgive and forget them and me or not. But it is better to forgive and forget rather than carry the grudge throughout your life.

Wishing you all the best once again,

On Godly Service,
Arjun

[Larena]

I wish you the best too. And to your family. May you be happy and wealthy.

I think the cultural differences between India and Europe became an impediment in your continuance in AIVV.

I think that the superiority which AIVV diaplays over any other culture and life style became this. A lot of imo prejudice and harmful imo stereotypes I found in it. I cannot live in prejudice.

[arjun]

I wish you the best too. And to your family. May you be happy and wealthy.

Thanks.

[sita]

Dear Larena,
Do you think keeping such conditions in centers, mistreating of this sister and you is deliberate?

[satyaprakash]

I deny all other allegations Arjun presented. I placed my story in Ex-PBK section. If you want to fight, dispute and argue, Arjun, I am asking you to go to your section and fight there spreading your twisted facts. This section is for Ex-PBKs. Let's stick to this division. I don't want a discussion with PBKs. I am tired of those futile pseudo-discussions in my opinion. In all discusions (particularly those recorded ) I could only experience how PBKs twist infromation and even contradict what they said earlier. I don't discuss with them anymore - that part is over. I only display facts right from my diary. I take advantage of the division of sections. I would like to protect myself from PBKs at least in this way. So let Mr Arjun stay far from the sections for Ex-PBK.

Ms Larena,
Well, well, well. More direct evidence on what is happening in PBK centres.
Ms.Larena should understand that this bk-pbk forum has a very small reach and very few people read it. As such nothing much will come out of her revelations. As a pbk one is supposed to just believe whatever their baba says. Any deviation will make you an ex-pbk! Only ill informed foreigners like you and innocent local women will get trapped in such bk or pbk cults.
When earlier I wrote that pbk centres are only mini jails without even good air supply, Arjun was protesting. Now it seems that they are TB breeding centres with many mentally affected people keeping company to the jailed inmates. If you show your brain to them, they will wash it clean! So hide and run!

Larena, You still have your body and soul together. Keep it that way and rebuild your life in a mentally and physically healthy way. If you write here nothing much will happen. Only a few people read it and they do nothing about any thinking!
If you want some action against those who ill treated you, you can approach many NGOs who fight for women's rights all over India. Local police may not do much to help you as many politicians are also believers of this baba and they will save him.
If you don't want further confrontation, simply go to a comfortable place of your choice and lead a normal family life.
Best wishes for a happy and healthy long life to you.
Regards,
Satya.(non bk, non pbk- only ordinary Hindu!)

[arjun]

Local police may not do much to help you as many politicians are also believers of this Baba and they will save him.

Do you have any proof or just reproducing hearsay?
To the best of my knowledge there is no politician included among PBKs.

[fluffy bunny]

Satya.(non BK, non pbk- only ordinary Hindu!)

Satyaprakash,

I don't remember ... are you involved with the Vishnu Party?

How did you gain your knowledge of the BK movements, and would you describe yourself as anti-BK?

Your mention of women's NGOs remind me of the "Pink" Gulabi Gang and their semi-criminal attack on the PBKs. I understand that despite causing much damage to the property of the PBKs, and many items being stolen, that it came to nothing in the end.

I support Larena in raising the issue in public. The conversation has to start somewhere, however small.

In real world terms, even the BKs are a very minor religion of interest to very few people ... but we have to speak out where there is abuse.

Thank you.

[rmn]

My dear soul brother Larena,
It is happened to see u r letter on discussion forum. It is very very ssorrow full case. I do't want to tell u any extra things. For u r bitterment pl use the ShivBap knowldege which u have taken from BKs and PBKs. ShivBap is right and correct pl follow him and churn the Murli points. No human being is right Nirkar bap our Father is right. In this discussion forum also lot of disputes are there. Seniors and juniors etc., We should follow srimat of ShivBap i.e. 4 am amrutvela, 8hrs yad,churning of muralis and soul concessiouness,this is sufficient to reach near to ShivBap and to make our stage higher. U have seen practically the incidence so that it is easy to us tell many things but it is very difficulty to forget the incidence by u. Any how as per ShivBap the Gyan is correct and right, pl have believe on shivabap and follow srimat wherever u r. U have earned lot of knowledge of ShivBap, use it for u r betterment and for others betterment by telling who is god and where is he and what he is doing.
thank
i will conclude.
best of luck
ohm shanti

[satyaprakash]

I don't remember ... are you involved with the Vishnu Party?

fb, You keep mentioning Vishnu Party. Who is that?

In real world terms, even the BKs are a very minor religion of interest to very few people

who is discussing bk here?
We have a suffering women who was ill treated.
In a western country the action for this will be severe and many will be in prison for 30 to 100 years for such acts. Here they call themselves as some baba and go scot free.

Do you have any proof or just reproducing hearsay?
To the best of my knowledge there is no politician included among PBKs.

You want me to produce a sworn affidavit from those corrupt politicians? If you say there is no politician involved- so be it. That does not take away your aivv responsibility to treat inmates properly.
The minimum you can do is open the windows of your mini jails and of your heart and brain. Your means your baba and all of pbk. As hardly a dozen people read this web site, there is not much point in discussing here.
Satya.

[fluffy bunny]

who is discussing BK here?

I guess I see the BKs and the PBKs are one religious movement.

As hardly a dozen people read this web site, there is not much point in discussing here.

Although only dozen may contribute, many more read it. Perhaps more would if people engaged in cordial, interesting and friendly discussions from time to time or developed a valuable information resource?

When this forum was started, it was started with the intention of it being a place where PBKs could come and meet and share ideas with each other. Even if they are entirely wrong, they still deserve a place of their own to share with each other in peace, and work things out.

It's pointless arguing on the internet. It achieves so little. If you want to start any anti-PBK or ex-PBK forum to conspire against the PBKs and inform others about, please go ahead and do so. But do it well.

The big problem I have seen with anti-PBKs is that the quality of their argument ... the logic of their approach is so off putting they make me sympathetic towards the PBKs.

Yes, I am sure there are problems and I am sympathetic to Larena as she is still "coming down" from the BK madness but, please, report issues in an honest, detailed and unexaggerated manner ... and if you need help leaving the BKs or the PBKs, please go to brahmakumaris.info where people will help you to do so.

[satyaprakash]

If you want to start any anti-PBK or ex-PBK forum to

if you need help leaving the BKs or the PBKs

I am not a bk or pbk and hence no need for any help in leaving them!
I am not anti-bk or anti-pbk but only anti cheating and anti fooling of people by any cult. The number of families ruined by these cult's propaganda is much more than the number of inmates in all their jails put together. Some of the ruined families are known to me and hence my views.
It does not interest me if you are anti-bk and pro-pbk. Be what you want, but do not help them to ruin more married men and women and more families connected with them. The result is their founders, organisers, supporters and sharers- cohorts have a great time while the families keep suffering.
satya

[fluffy bunny]

Some of the ruined families are known to me and hence my views.

... Then I apologise and empathise with you, and them. I'd like to know more about the ruination of families you mention, and the effect you see they are having in general. If you are yourself not involved with any of the groups and are "friends and family of", then you might be better off at http://brahmakumaris.info.

I am very concerned about the effect on poorer families the BKs are having in India, and am not aware of it as I am in the West.

In the West, BK adherents generally come from better off, middle class family ... and there are other means of social welfare support for elderly or invalid parents.

I am concerned not just for parents of BKs ... where they are encouraged to disregard them ... but also elderly BKs who, when the End of the World does not come will be left without any pension, savings, home etc in their old age having given away their wealth and best years to the BKs. Even a few years engagement can mean the waste of a life, the loss of education, the chance to marry etc. As you know, the BKs have been breaking up families since the 1930s. We have also seen children of BK neglected and lose their parents.


If there is the *smallest* chance there is any truth to the BK religion then all the disturbances to the families *might* be excusable ... but there is little evidence to suggest it at this time.