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Discussion of ShivBaba's Knowledge & 'Advanced Knowledge', suited for EVERYONE associated with 'PrajaPita Brahma Kumaris Spiritual Godly World University-cum-Hospital'.
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For those who wish to narrate their experiences about the BKs and PBK 'Advanced Knowledge' and post views about their NEW beliefs.
suryavanshi wrote: Supreme Soul Shiv never does any shooting since He is asochta and akarta. The shooting is done by Brahma and Brahmin children. Supreme Soul Shiv only speaks Gyan through the body of Veerendra Dev Dixit and this will continue till Brahma ki raat is not over, i.e. until the one second of Brahma so Vishnu has not come.
Dear Bhai.
I cannot accept that on one hand ShivBaba is giving Gyan and on the other hand brahma ki raat is going on; can you prove through Murli points that both things can go on simultaneously.
shivsena
shivsena wrote:I cannot accept that on one hand ShivBaba is giving Gyan and on the other hand Brahma ki raat is going on;
Your quotation may be caricatured as 'No Gyan during Night of Brahma & no transformation of Night of Brahma into the Day of Brahma without Gyan' model of Gyan. Is not Gyan necessary during Night of Brahma? And, how will the Night of Brahma be converted into the Day of Brahma without Gyan? You state that Ramshivbaba will give powerful drishti (vision) to make Rudra-beads soul-conscious & then He will give Gyan to them. Then, is not Gyan necessary to be soul-conscious?
Why ... why will the Ocean of Knowledge, i.e, God use the tools of Bhakti-marg like drishti to make Rudra-beads soul-conscious; and for what purpose, He will apply the tools of Gyan like Shrimat after the completion of the final lesson of Gyan, i.e, achievement of soul-conscious stage of Rudra-beads??? Do you mean that a university lecturer first awards degrees to his students & then delivers lectures to them?
I know of only one thing: Murlis says ''when there is Gyan there cannot be Bhakti and when there is Bhakti there is no Gyan'' and Murli says that brahma ki raat = Bhakti and brahma ka din = Gyan and Murlis also says that ''Bap behad ki raat ke anth mein aate hain''. How raat converts into din will be revealed only by Ramshivbaba.
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Quoted from the BK Section for the kind attention of Shivsena Bhai:
330. “अभी तुम श्रीमत से २१ जन्म के लिए श्रेष्ठ ते श्रेष्ठ बन रहे हो। आसुरी मत द्वापर से शुरू होती है, जिसको विशस वर्ल्ड कहा जाता है। विशस वर्ल्ड स्थापन करने वाला है रावण। वाइसलेस वर्ल्ड स्थापन करने वाला है राम, शिवबाबा।...अभी माया भी फारेनर है, आधाकल्प से राज्य किया है।बाप आकर इनसे छुड़ाते हैं। माया ने तुम्हें बहुत दुःखी किया है, इसलिए बाप कहते हैं – मैं आता हूँ लिबरेट करने। अब श्रीमत पर चलो। नहीं तो माया एकदम कच्चा खा जायेगी।“(ब्रह्माकुमारियों द्वारा प्रकाशित रिवाइज़्ड साकार मुरली दिनांक १९.०४.०८, पृ.२ एवं ३)
“Abhi tum Shrimat say 21 janma ke liye shreshth tey shreshth ban rahey ho. Aasuri mat Dwapar say shuru hoti hai, jisko vicious world kahaa jaataa hai. Vicious world sthaapan karney vala hai Ravan. Viceless world sthaapan karney vala hai Ram, ShivBaba...Abhi Maya bhi foreigner hai, aadhakalpa say raajya kiya hai. Baap aakar insay chudaatey hain. Maya nay tumhey bahut dukhi kiya hai, isliye Baap kahtey hain – mai aata hoon liberate karney. Ab Shrimat par chalo. Nahee toh Maya ekdam kachcha kha jaayegi."(Brahmakumariyon dwara prakaashit revised Sakar Murli, dinaank 19.04.08, pg 2&3)
“Now you are becoming most righteous for 21 births. The demoniac opinion begins from the Copper Age, which is called a vicious world. The one who establishes the vicious world is Ravan. The one who establishes the viceless world is Ram, ShivBaba...Now Maya is also a foreigner; she has ruled for half a Kalpa. The Father comes and liberates us from her. Maya has made you very sorrowful; that is why the Father says – I come to liberate you. Now follow the Shrimat. Otherwise, Maya will eat you raw.”(Revised Sakar Murli dated 19.04.08, pg 2&3 published by BKs in Hindi, narrated by ShivBaba through Brahma Baba; translated by a PBK; the words within brackets in the English version have been added by the translator to clarify the meaning)
Two of your most often repeated issues have been addressed in the above Murli point. It proves that Ram and ShivBaba are different terms and not a single word as you have been writing and predicting on this forum.
It also proves who is Maya. It says that Maya is a foreigner, i.e. belonging to a religion that has started from the Copper Age that belongs to the foreign land (videshi). It also says that it has ruled for half a Kalpa. Everyone knows that the first foreign soul to enter from the Soul World is the soul of Abraham who establishes Islam. So, the seed-like and root-like souls of the PBK and BK worlds are the practical forms of Maya in the Confluence Age.
arjun wrote:
Two of your most often repeated issues have been addressed in the above Murli point. It proves that Ram and ShivBaba are different terms and not a single word as you have been writing and predicting on this forum.
Arjun
Dear arjun Bhai.
It is just amazing to note on how you can concentrate on punctuation marks and completely ignore words and sentences of Shiva's Murlis, which clearly say that ''Ram is ShivBaba'', ''Ram is bhagwan'', ''Ram is ishwar'' etc. I have always said that shiv and Ram are two seperate entities in the shooting period and personified God cannot be revealed until the incorporeal Father shiv and incorporeal stage of Ram's soul merges and becomes one single entity as Ramshivbaba. Bindishiv or Ram's soul cannot do anything without each other, as is evident from the fact that inspite of bindishiv coming in 1937 the world has not been redeemed; only when the two combine and become one single entity then souls will be liberated from evil. Whether the words 'Ram' and 'ShivBaba' are seperated by comma or by space, to me Ramshivbaba is the combination of shiv and Ram, without which it is impossible to get salvation.
BTW what are we debating about??? Do you not believe that one day in future Shiv(incorporeal Father) and Ram (incorporeal stage) will merge and then sacchi Gita will be narrated; then where is the question of seeing them as two different words seperated by comma.
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shivsena wrote:BTW what are we debating about??? Do you not believe that one day in future Shiv(incorporeal Father) and Ram (incorporeal stage) will merge and then sacchi Gita will be narrated; then where is the question of seeing them as two different words seperated by comma.
The difference between you and us is that you live in future like the bhagats of the path of worship who are waiting for God to incarnate as Kalki to salvage them from this old world while we feel that God is practically with us and guiding us to become like deities.
The difference between you and us is that you feel the entire advanced knowledge to be false, whereas we consider it to be knowledge that is undergoing refining and changing according to the increasing understanding power of children.
arjun wrote:The difference between you and us is that you live in future like the bhagats of the path of worship who are waiting for God to incarnate as Kalki to salvage them from this old world while we feel that God is practically with us and guiding us to become like deities.
Dear arjun Bhai.
I would rather live like a Bhagat in brahma ki raat and wait for the practical personified form of God ShivBaba to reveal himself in near future, than to live in complete ignorance and darkness and live under a false illusion that God ShivBaba is with me(as most PBKs are doing).
The difference between you and us is that you feel the entire advanced knowledge to be false, whereas we consider it to be knowledge that is undergoing refining and changing according to the increasing understanding power of children.
It is good to note that the increasing understanding power of PBKs have accepted that advance knowledge is undergoing refining and changing (and not the complete truth), and that day is not very far off when the whole pbk family will also accept that the advance knowledge in nothing but jhooti Gita. The first step is already taken, the last step is not far behind.
If you accept about yourself that you are Bhagat, then you are in the darkness of ignorance. How will you become king - an aim you have revealed you keep for yourself? In the Murli it is said there are Baba's children, heirs, praja and bhagats. So is it Baba's child or Bhagat. Child means the Father is a soul and the child is also a soul. Bhakti starts from Copper Age. If you are Bhagat instead of child then you must definetely be Maya's child, because Bhakti starts from Maya, and bhagats do Bhakti. Then on the path of Bhakti, there is no knowledge, whatever you say as Bhagat will be ignorance.
How will you become a king, if you don't become child first. Will Baba teach his bhagats or children? Oh, yes i forgot. You have a whole theory. He will chose you. He will chose 108 souls and teach them Raja Yoga. One of them is you. For you there is no impartiality. God does not give and teach equally.
If you don't feel ShivBaba is with you, if you feel yourself in the night of ignorance, does it mean that Shibaba is now with anyone else, and they are not in the light of knowledge. You know from the scriptures and also from Murlis that God gives his company to very few.
It is good to know you have taken the firts step towards truth by recognizing the falsehood. You will become Arjun by taking first steps. You will lead others and do their benefit.
It is just amazing to note on how you can concentrate on punctuation marks
Dear brother shivsena,
Punctuation is not to be underestimated. You might know about the story of a sentence of a person, that due to lack of the comma could mean two completely opposite things. "To be killed, not to be forgiven" or "To be killed not, to be forgiven"
arjun wrote:Can you quote a Murli/Avyakt Vani where it is said that the role of Father-Teacher-Sadguru is played simultaneously?
Dear arjun Bhai.
Quoting a Murli point 1-11-99 which says " Bap , Bap bhi hai, teacher bhi hai, Satguru bhi hai. Teeno roop mein Yaad karo toh teeno varsa milega." [ meaning that :Father is Father also, Teacher also and Satguru also. If you remember in all 3 forms then you will get all three inheritance."]
The above Murli clearly states that ''Father is Bap-teacher-Satguru'' (three-in-one); not bindi Father Shiva but when Shiv and Ram become combined, then Ramshivbaba becomes the combined Bap-teacher-Satguru. (all the titles of bindi shiv are then transfered to Ram's soul, who will become personified ShivBaba).
BKs and PBKs have been remembering bindi ShivBaba as Bap-teacher-Satguru and no one has received any inheritance from bindishiv; As Bap, bindishiv has not given any inheritance of vishwa ki rajai; as Teacher, bindishiv has not given any clarification which can be termed as truth; nor as Satguru, bindishiv has not given any sadgati to anyone in last 70 years. So it is very clear that only when Ram and shiv become combined as Ramshivbaba, then all souls will get all 3 inheritance in one second numberwise.
Now it is your turn to prove with Murli points, the advance knowledge belief that the role of Bap-teacher-Satguru is played at different times and please specify the time frame of each role.
shivsena.
Yes, when the final role of the Satguru is played then it would be said taht the three roles had been completed. But if it is not being played now, does it mean that other roles are not going on?
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shivsena wrote:Quoting a Murli point 1-11-99 which says " Bap , Bap bhi hai, teacher bhi hai, Satguru bhi hai. Teeno roop mein Yaad karo toh teeno varsa milega." [ meaning that :Father is Father also, Teacher also and Satguru also. If you remember in all 3 forms then you will get all three inheritance."]
The above Murli point does not say that all three roles are played simultaneously.
arjun wrote: The above Murli point does not say that all three roles are played simultaneously.
Then please give us the break-up of advance knowledge version of how the role of bap-teacher-Satguru is played in parts during Sangamyug and the time frame of each role.
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shivsena wrote:Then please give us the break-up of Advanced Knowledge version of how the role of bap-teacher-Satguru is played in parts during Sangamyug and the time frame of each role.
I cannot specify the exact time period because neither I am an astrologer like you nor has ShivBaba (through Veerendra Dev Dixit) specified such time frames so far (as far as I know). But I have heard from Baba that the role of the Father was played in the beginning to sow the seed of knowledge and the role of the Father will be played again in the end to give the inheritance. Since 1976 ShivBaba (through Veerendra Dev Dixit) has been playing the role of a teacher. The sadguru's role will also be played in the end.
In VCD 602, in Murli 10.7.1967 it is said...you forget the Father, then you could remember the teacher. you receive 3 chances. Remember the Father, remember the teacher, remember the guru. If you forget one remember the other...this may lead one to conlcude that these 3 are not played simulateously, because if one remembers one of these that are played simulaneously then he will automatically remember the other. Then also why it would be said that there are 3 chances if it was played at 1 time, it would be 1 chance in 3 ways.
