Who is Maa adi-shakti - feminine side of God Shiva ???

[sachkhand]

Shiv + D.Lekharaj = Practical Corporeal GodFather

There is practical GodMother also. I do not know who is that. But it is not Saraswati Mama. This GodMother is the couple of D. Lekharaj or Lakshmi in L.N. picture alongwith Narayan.

Saraswati Mama is the eldest child of The Mother and Father of Humanity.

Also this eldest child is the best friend of The practical GodFather. Bharat ko aapas main ladaaya, means Father and this child get opposite to each other due to some misunderstanding. This happens due to Ravan.

Saraswati Mama is in no way the practical form of Shiv, The Supreme Soul. She is the first to understand ShivBaba and The Parents of Humanity. They are the backbone for Saraswati Mama. She is not with her own corporeal physical body now. She is gupt, without her own physical body now.

In the end, ShivBaba will get revealed through physical corporeal body. And that is the next birth of D. Lekharaj. Cannot say anything about this persoanlity now.
:neutral:
Sanjeev.

[shivsena]

Shiv + D.Lekharaj = Practical Corporeal GodFather.
There is practical GodMother also. I do not know who is that.
Saraswati Mama is the eldest child of The Mother and Father of Humanity.
She is not with her own corporeal physical body now. She is gupt, without her own physical body now.
Sanjeev.

Dear sanjeev.

Are you trying to say that there is practical Godfather and Godmother in seperate bodies(two different souls) and they will be revealed in future.....this goes against the teaching of Murlis which say that mata-pita are combined.(ardh-nari-ishwar)

And you also say that Mama is eldest child and is gupt without her own corporeal body and she is narrating Vanis in mt abu.....how can parents of Mama be corporeal, when she is not having a corporeal body.....your theory looks pretty confusing to a logical mind.

shivsena

[sachkhand]

Dear sanjeev.
Are you trying to say that there is practical Godfather and Godmother in seperate bodies(two different souls) and they will be revealed in future.....this goes against the teaching of Murlis which say that mata-pita are combined.(ardh-nari-ishwar)

Please understand me correctly. I have clearly said that D. Lekharaj is the Banni of Supreme Soul Shiv. And D. L. is Prajapita. It is said that Prajapita is the name of the patit body. But the body has to be of some human soul. Who is that? It is D.L., and therefore he is Prajapita too. And this Prajapita is the combined form Maat-Pita or Shiv Shakti combination of Bhakti marg. But for practical purpose where we consider or need a practical form of GodFather in physical, there has to be a practical form of GodMother too. And that GodMother is the better half of D.L., who is also considered as Narayan (as per my opinion) of the L.N. picture, and hence the better half is also Lakshmi of the L.N. picture. And this couple can be called as Great 2 GrandFather and GrandMother by the later human generations. And it is said in Murlis that when there is Great 2 GrandFather there is GrandMother too and Grand Children too.

And you also say that Mama is eldest child and is gupt without her own corporeal body and she is narrating Vanis in mt abu.....how can parents of Mama be corporeal, when she is not having a corporeal body.....your theory looks pretty confusing to a logical mind.

I am not saying that Mama is physical child of the two. Do you think that when practical corporeal form of ShivBaba is revealed then all the human souls will be with their physical corporeal body on this earth. If not, then are not these human souls also the children of Prajapita along with Supreme Soul Shiv? In similiar way, Mama too is child (but eldest based on the knowledge she has) of Prajapita although she does not have physical corporeal body of her own now.
:neutral:
Sanjeev.

[shivsena]

Please understand me correctly. I have clearly said that D. Lekharaj is the Banni of Supreme Soul Shiv. And D. L. is Prajapita.
Sanjeev.

Dear sanjeev Bhai.

I am trying very hard to understand you, but my logic prevents me from accepting that child jagdamba(in avaykt stage) is narrating av. Vanis through Dadi Gulzar and her corporeal parents have taken birth but you do not know where.....OK....who were they in their previous birth???....one of them you said was Lekhraj Kirpalani in previous birth and who was the other soul who will become corporeal mother in future.

shivsena.

[shivsena]

Dear bk-pbk brothers.

Sharing what i read on the net.
shivsena.
==========================================================================
"The future will see the re-emergence of reverence for the Divine Mother that we knew in past ages."

The Divine Mother, called the Universal Mother or Cosmic Virgin, is the feminine polarity of the Godhead. She is the "other side" of Father. In Jewish tradition, the feminine aspect of God is called Shekhinah, literally "Divine Presence." In Hinduism she appears as Shakti, in Buddhism as Prajnaparamita, and in Egyptian tradition as Isis. In some texts of the Old Testament , the feminine aspect of the divine is called Wisdom, just as the Christian gnostics called her Sophia. In the East she is known as Kuan Yin, the Chinese Goddess of Mercy and Compassion and in the West as Mary, Mother of Jesus. Being multi-faceted, the Divine Mother has a thousand and one faces and her reflection is constantly changing.

The sacred interchange of energy that is God flows from Spirit to Matter, Matter to Spirit. Matter (the material cosmos) symbolically represents the womb of the Mother. The Mother anchors the energies released from Spirit (Father) into Matter (Mother). She brings the formlessness of Spirit (Father) into form. The Divine feminine is the highest expression or aspect of man and woman and we need both Mother and Father for wholeness and balance.

The myriad faces of the Mother explain her being. She can assume any form ranging from the gentle comforter to the fearless warrior. She can be tender and playful(Maa jagdamba) or terrifying and ferocious(mahakali). The Goddess reveals herself as Woman Warrior, Teacher, Mother and Consort. In different moods, she appears youthful, ancient, or ageless. She is divine creativity, evolutionary energy, timeless awareness, transcendent reality, and, in a special tantric sense, she is every woman. She constitutes the feminine principle within male and female persons and also manifests the gender-free feminine – self-luminous Mother Wisdom, nondual awareness and bliss.

Praise be to the Divine Mother
The Inscrutable power in all things.
Praise be to the Divine Mother
The Intelligence in all beings.
Praise be to the Divine Mother
The Forgiveness in all things.
Praise be to the Divine Mother
The Peacefulness in all things.
Praise be to the Divine Mother
The Faithfulness in all things.
Praise be to the Divine Mother
The Beauty in all things.
Praise be to the Divine Mother
The Mercy in all things.
Praise be to the Divine Mother
The Consciousness in all things.
============================

Who is the soul in Sangamyug who played such a highest role....and who is remembered and praised in the above paragraph from Bhakti-marg scriptures ?????
=======================================================

[sachkhand]

Dear sanjeev Bhai.
I am trying very hard to understand you, but my logic prevents me from accepting that child jagdamba(in avaykt stage) is narrating av. Vanis through Dadi Gulzar and her corporeal parents have taken birth but you do not know where.....OK....who were they in their previous birth???....one of them you said was Lekhraj Kirpalani in previous birth and who was the other soul who will become corporeal mother in future.

I think I have made it very clear. O.K.. I will try to explain my views once more.

First, tell me, whether all the human souls will be in their own physical corporeal body on this earth at the time of revealation i.e., when The Practical corporeal Form of ShivBaba is revealed?
I do not think so. In my opinion some human souls (compared to the total human souls) will not have their own corporeal physical body.

Now, it is said in Murlis that Supreme Soul Shiv is the Father of all human souls. But on this earth when atma becomes jeevatma, they have Prajapita too as their Father. So, in the end all souls whether they have their own physical corporeal body or not, they all are children of both Supreme Soul Shiv and Prajapita Brahma. And hence there is nothing illogical when I am saying that Mama Saraswati is the eldest child of The Parents of Humanity although she is not having her own physical corporeal body on this earth.


Jeevatma D. Lekharaj is Prajapita and also the Banni of Supreme Soul Shiv. Or rather, he is Prajapita only because he is The Banni of Supreme Soul Shiv.
Please read carefully the matter you have given from the net. I quote from that same matter,
(1) "The sacred interchange of energy that is God flows from Spirit to Matter, Matter to Spirit. Matter (the material cosmos) symbolically represents the womb of the Mother. The Mother anchors the energies released from Spirit (Father) into Matter (Mother)."

As Shiv has chosen D.Lekharaj according to the drama as the ANCHOR and hence that Jeevatma is The Banni of Supreme Soul Shiv.

Now,
(2) "She constitutes the feminine principle within male and female persons and also manifests the gender-free feminine self-luminous Mother Wisdom, nondual awareness and bliss."
This is THE ONE COMBINATION. As ShivBaba is Anadi Prajapita is also Anadi. And this Anadi Prajapita is THE ONE COMBINATION. ShivBaba is just GodFather and not Maat+Pita. But Prajapita is Maat+Pita and still Anadi. ShivBaba is the flower of the rosary, and Prajapita is the next bead. There is also another bead which is the connection for The Creator and the creation i.e., rosary. And this jeevatma is Eve or Lakshmi or Aadi of this creation.

The soul D.L. is The Banni of Shiv. But, but soul of Ravan and other like souls want to control D.L.
But can they really do it? Aundhe mooh girengey. And you can see it happenning everywhere.

So this combination i.e., D.L + Supreme Soul Shiv = Practical Shiv.
Where Father of Atma and Father of Jeevatma, both are combined, THE ONE COMBINATION.

But how can there be creation without getting expressed as two.
Now, what next?
(3) "Being multi-faceted, the Divine Mother has a thousand and one faces and her reflection is constantly changing."
Does the above sentence means that there are just 1001 faces accurately or it is just to say that the Divine Mother has many faces?

So THE ONE COMBINATION has another jeevatma which is the practical Mother of this creation. And this is the same which has been mentioned above as the Aadi of the rosary or Eve or Lakshmi. And who is she now or in her previous birth, that I do not know at present.

It is D.L. of THE ONE COMBINATION, that is expressed as The Mother of creation through this Jeevatma or becomes Sakar through this Mother to create. Shiv is The Nirakaar entity in THE ONE COMBINATION and D.L. is the Sakar entity in THE ONE COMBINATION. As is said in Murlis, Goodh jaane Goodh ki gothri jaane. Goodh is ShivBaba and Gothri is D.L. who is the covering of The Goodh ShivBaba in the form of Prajapita. no one can surpass Prajapita and taste Goodh ShivBaba. THE ONE COMBINATION can be tasted only when D.L. leaves the way. And these checks are there for the jeevatmas. First through Mama Saraswati or the eldest child, then through Aadi or Eve or The Mother of the creation, and finally directly D.L. within THE ONE COMBINATION. Those who pass all the three can taste The Goodh ShivBaba. But then too it is not direct ShivBaba, but through the Anadi Prajapita.

These two i.e., THE ONE COMBINATION and the jeevatma mentioned here, are the practical Father and Mother of all human souls or jeevatmas irrespective of whether any of these creation jeevatmas will have their own physical corporeal body or not in the end.

Later, in their creation,
amongst all the human souls or jeevatmas, Mama Saraswati's soul is the eldest (based on the knowledge that jeevatma has).

(4)"The myriad faces of the Mother explain her being. She can assume any form ranging from the gentle comforter to the fearless warrior. She can be tender and playful(Maa jagdamba) or terrifying and ferocious(mahakali). The Goddess reveals herself as Woman Warrior, Teacher, Mother and Consort. In different moods, she appears youthful, ancient, or ageless. She is divine creativity, evolutionary energy, timeless awareness, transcendent reality, and, in a special tantric sense, she is every woman."

As explained above (in coloured font), D.L. gets expressed and acts as checks in different levels of the creation.
It is actually THE ONE COMBINATION Who is pulling the strings and stands as the backbone of all who surrenders and loves THAT.


And this jeevatma, Mama Saraswati is the caretaker of the creation of the actual parents and is playing the part of the ring master of the Great Brahmakumaris circus. But it is actually THE ONE COMBINATION that is the actual Backbone.

You must have heard that how some tantricks use departed soul to get their work done. But in this case, it is not due to any pressure or force. It is due to LOVE. It is due to LOVE AND SURRENDERING, the jeevatma Mama Saraswati has received the powers of THE ONE COMBINATION and along with that also the responsibilty of taking care of the youngsters. Numberwise all jeevatmas rceive powers as well as responsibilities depending on their capabilities. What is the capapbility required? Understanding THE ONE COMBINATION. How can it be judged? By their capacity to give Unconditional Love to all Jeevatmas.

Few who recognise this jeevatma i.e., Saraswati Mama playing the part, start considering the Jeevatma Saraswati as The practical form of The GodFather Shiv. And consider the part played by this soul as the part of The GodFather. But unless and untill, TRUE ONE COMBINATION comes into action, there will be no practical results. And due to this misunderstanding, the child Jeevatma Saraswati is considered as The Practical GodFather Shiv. And this is said in Murlis that is to happen. And it is happening.

Only eight will understand THE ONE COMBINATION, that too numberwise. You can change the terms used for The Flower and The Anadi bead and The Aadi bead of the rosary. But the principle is same. This is what I feel.
:neutral:
Sanjeev.

[shivsena]

Dear sanjeev.

Thanks for your detailed explanation...but it just does not make any sense to me as there are many loose ends.

Our theories are poles apart: i can never accept DL no 1 shiv-shakti as he left his body due to heart attack and never became karmatit....and i can never accept Mama as spiritual daughter of DL, as Mama was far ahead than DL in all aspects.....so i will abide by my theory that no. 1 soul in this drama is Mama Saraswati(Ram's soul) and will be revealed as no 1 shiv-shakti (universal cosmic mother--vande mataram)in future.....and so it is better that we do not have any further debate on this matter.

Those BKs-PBKs or ex-PBKs who expect shiv to be revealed through a male body (prajapita brahma)in future are praja-quality souls as it has been said in Murlis that "prajapita hai toh praja bhi saath mein hogi".......those souls who will accept Mama Saraswati as avaykt brahma narrating the Vanis at present and those who believe in HER being revealed as no 1 shivshakti (personified ShivBaba) will get rajayi ka varsa ["Ek Alaf ko jaano toh badshahi tumari"]
shivsena.

[shivsena]

Also if she is to become a part of the personified form of ShivBaba according to you, then why did not she attain the 100% nirakari stage when she was alive?
indie.

Dear indiana.

If all of us go back to our childhood days, when we swear as children we have always spoken the words "Maa kasam" in India, and in English language the children have always uttered the words "GOD promise"....the words "Bap-kasam" or "Father promise" are never uttered....so i was just wondering whether there is any connection between God being revealed as mother (Maa adi-shakti) only, while God Shiva always being the support behind Maa-adi-shakti. ["vande mataram hai toh vande pitaram saath mein hai hi"]... Children are always closer to Mother than Father in lokik life, so why not be closer to Godmother (Maa adi-shakti ie adi-brahma) who is going to be instrumental in opening the gates of heaven.

shivsena.

[shivsena]

Dear indiana.

The whole world uses the phrase "mother-tongue" and never "Father-tongue"...if Murlis were spoken by Father Shiva(through DL) and the explanations of advance knowledge are also given by Father Shiva (through Baba Dixit), then the phrase "Father tongue" should have been remembered in Bhakti-marg.....so i feel that Sakar Murlis and av. Vanis have been spoken by Maa adi-shakti jagdamba Saraswati(goddess of knowledge) and not Father Shiva (Ocean of knowledge), who will summarise the whole knowledge in the end by just explaining two words :"Man-mana-bhav and madhya-ji-bhav" ; "Alaf aur Be". Those children who accept mother adi-shakti jagdamba as their guru(narrating Murlis and Vanis) will then be called ''matale bacche'' and those who do not identify the mother jagdamba as their guru will then be called ''sautele bacche'' (Murli point: "mataa guru bigar uddhar nahin"..."no salvation without mother guru")... This is what i have derived from churning and touchings from Maa Saraswati.

shivsena.

[shivsena]

Dear indiana and rudraputra.

Who is no. 1 shivshakti (paramatma part) with whom parampita shiv is always combined.

Is it DL Brahma (Chariot of Shiva - according to BKs, and who never understood the Murlis as he was supposed to be baccha-buddhi),
Is it VD prajapita brahma (Chariot of Shiva -- according to PBKs, who was taught the 7 days basic Godly course by another soul )....or,
Is it Mama jagdamba Saraswati (goddess of knowledge), who never took the Godly course and just narrated the knowledge which emerged in her from time to time.

One of the above 3 souls is no.1 shivshakti.....there is no fourth possibility.... and the nischay(faith) in one of them is going to decide who will become numberwise shivshakti-pandavsena. (nischay-buddhi vijayanti)

Can any pbk please give his views.
shivsena.

[pbkindiana]

shivsena wrote:
If all of us go back to our childhood days, when we swear as children we have always spoken the words "Maa kasam" in India, and in English language the children have always uttered the words "GOD promise"...the words "Bap-kasam" or "Father promise" are never uttered....so i was just wondering whether there is any connection between God being revealed as mother (Maa adi-shakti) only, while God Shiva always being the support behind Maa-adi-shakti. ["vande mataram hai toh vande pitaram saath mein hai hi"]... Children are always closer to Mother than Father in lokik life, so why not be closer to Godmother (Maa adi-shakti ie adi-Brahma) who is going to be instrumental in opening the gates of heaven.

It is true that children are closer to mother than Father but it is always the fathers who give education to their children ---- paying school fees, then college fees, university fees,etc. and then make sure that their children stand on their on feet. Children are closer to their mothers because of the mother's unconditional love and mothers are not strict with their children so naturally children become closer to their mothers just like Brahma D. Lekraj who always played the tolerance role. Brahma D. Lekraj (Jagadhamba) is the most senior mother and it is said in Murlis that "actually this Brahma is your mother but the body is male"--- so actually she is the shakti. Also I have read in the Murli that women are gateway to heaven because of child-bearing ( i cannot remember the Murli date).

Moreover only fathers give away their properties to their children and i have seen in Indian movies that the son who becomes the apple of his Father's eyes becomes the sole benefactor of his Father's property.

Also it is said in Murlis "that you children need to have the brain (Jagadpita) and the heart (Jagadhamba). As it is said "follow mother but listen to Father."

indie.

[pbkindiana]

shivsena wrote:

The whole world uses the phrase "mother-tongue" and never "Father-tongue"...if Murlis were spoken by Father Shiva(through DL) and the explanations of Advanced Knowledge are also given by Father Shiva (through Baba Dixit), then the phrase "Father tongue" should have been remembered in Bhakti-marg....

When it is said mother tongue, then it denotes that when the bodily mother who speaks the Sach Gita to her children, then she do the foundation of this phrase in bakti marg ( as it is commonly asked 'what is your mother tongue?). So it cannot be Om Radhe who had left her body and to-date nobody knows whether she has taken birth or not.

so i feel that Sakar Murlis and av. Vanis have been spoken by Maa adi-shakti jagdamba Saraswati(goddess of knowledge) and not Father Shiva (Ocean of knowledge),

Did OM Radhe say "when i come, i give my own introduction" and does she knows anything about Shiv for her to speak Murlis? If she knows so much of Shiv, and to speak so much about Shiv, then with that much accumulated power, she wouldn't have died of cancer. You are confused. In the beginning you stressed that it is Ramshivbaba, now it is Om Radhe. You are just like a parrot --- first you were so obsessed with RamShivbaba and now you have changed your mindset to Om Radhe.

Also it is said MU 28.1.04 -- "This one is studying. Saraswathi too is studying." If Saraswathi is studying then how is it possible to teach others? A student never teaches others, only a teacher teaches.

no salvation without mother guru")[/b]... This is what i have derived from churning and touchings from Maa Saraswati.

One should be in a corporeal form to become a mother guru, so can you reveal who is this personality who will become mother guru. And do not tell puerile remakrs that we received salvation in the air.

indie.

[shivsena]

One should be in a corporeal form to become a mother guru, so can you reveal who is this personality who will become mother guru. And do not tell puerile remakrs that we received salvation in the air.
indie.

Dear indiana.

Since 1937, BKs felt that their Mama and Baba are corporeal and will deliver them from evil and give them salvation, but both left their bodies and the children were left alone (confused with no one to guide them).
Since 1990, the same story is with the PBKs, who again are confused without the mother and although the self-proclaimed Father is with them, there are only queries writ on the faces of PBKs and no salvation is forthcoming.

So what i feel, unless there is proper understanding of knowledge(Murlis) and connection(Yoga) with the supreme no. 1 shivshakti(who has become avaykt in 1965) we will never have the wings of "Gyan and Yoga" by which the soul will fly to avaykt BapDada (who is waiting for children in Subtle Region)....wings of Gyan will be acquired by churning the Murlis and wings of Yoga will be obtained by proper understanding of how to attain the avaykt stage by reading the Vanis of avaykt brahma (no.1 shivshakti)....this is what i feel.

shivsena.

[RudraPutra]

Since 1990, the same story is with the PBKs, who again are confused without the mother and although the self-proclaimed Father is with them, there are only queries writ on the faces of PBKs and no salvation is forthcoming.

...no pbk's are confused....the one who are confused are not pbk's....
"Ghaai gardi shaitaan ka kaam hota hai"....and sorry to say but you are the one among those who don't have patience at all.....just looking for the salvation,right from the start....
everyone are purusharthi...and purusharthi's are not complete,but the one who are trying to become complete....till then you can and you will definitely see flaws in them....but that's ridiculous to point out at this stage when everyone are doing purusharth....even in Murli it has been said "Jab tak baap hai,purusharth karo"...

there goes a short but solid story of hungry fox who wanted grapes from the vine...he tried but within short time he lose his heart and became impatient....finally he named the grapes sour,instead of blaming the self who failed to achieve those grapes,he blamed the grapes.....that's the most wicked thing to do....
you are also following the same path with one step ahead...here fox is trying to say each and every individual not to go near to that grape vine as they are not grapes but mayavi roop of grapes.......

the most simple thing to do in life...blame others for your failureness,that's it!!!

So what i feel, unless there is proper understanding of knowledge(Murlis) and connection(Yoga) with the supreme no. 1 shivshakti(who has become avaykt in 1965) we will never have the wings of "Gyan and Yoga" by which the soul will fly to avaykt BapDada (who is waiting for children in Subtle Region)....wings of Gyan will be acquired by churning the Murlis and wings of Yoga will be obtained by proper understanding of how to attain the avaykt stage by reading the Vanis of avaykt Brahma (no.1 shivshakti)....this is what i feel.

...just tell me the accurate 100 % meaning of this sentence....I saw you while bathing......i saw you while i was bathing or when you were bathing?????....here also you can come out with different meanings...how is it possible for you to understand the words of Murli accurately,that is how is it possible to understand what ShivBaba wanted to say??????....no possible way other than ShivBaba himself makes it clear....even in Murli it has been said "Gyaan ka saagar ek hi hai aur vah gyaan ka saagar hi sadgati data hai."....rest all are just the ways of hell,nothing else.....blunders the biggest blunders....
there goes a saying "Ya samjhe kavi ya samjhe ravi"...here both the kavi and ravi are ShivBaba,hence he is the one who can clear the facts of Murli.....not you and me....

[pbkindiana]

shivsena wrote:
Since 1937, BKs felt that their Mama and Baba are corporeal and will deliver them from evil and give them salvation, but both left their bodies and the children were left alone (confused with no one to guide them).
Since 1990, the same story is with the PBKs, who again are confused without the mother and although the self-proclaimed Father is with them, there are only queries writ on the faces of PBKs and no salvation is forthcoming.

So what i feel, unless there is proper understanding of knowledge(Murlis) and connection(Yoga) with the supreme no. 1 shivshakti(who has become avaykt in 1965) we will never have the wings of "Gyan and Yoga" by which the soul will fly to avaykt BapDada (who is waiting for children in Subtle Region)....wings of Gyan will be acquired by churning the Murlis and wings of Yoga will be obtained by proper understanding of how to attain the avaykt stage by reading the Vanis of avaykt Brahma (no.1 shivshakti)....this is what i feel.

I will not be replying to your post of this topic as we are loggerheads regarding this issue. You are so obsessed with the late Om Radhe; who now you are believing that she is a part of ShivBaba whereas it is said directly that "ShivBaba is a Father's part only" and also "Mother cannot become GOD"--- and I am so obsessed that Baba Dixit will be the personified form of ShivBaba and it is just a matter of time that when He emulates Shiv's 100% nirakari stage, then the role of Father - Teacher - Sadguru will commence. I feel it is a waste of time arguing for nothing, so i would like to agree to differ on this topic.

indie.