Lies/Errors in Murlis OR Is it way of teaching of ...

[shivshankar]

When Dadi Gulzar suddenly wakes up (Brahma Baba 's souls departs), does she wake up because Brahma Baba's soul was suppressing Dadi Gulzar's soul (sitting on her ?). And how does Brahma Baba's soul leave ?

As far as I know(according to BK's and to my common sense) Dadi Gulzar's soul (in her fine body) leaves her material body and stays in the Subtle Region while BB's soul (in his fine body) enters Dadi Gulzar material body. Supreme Soul also comes at the moment or may be a little bit later. After that BB leaves her body and she comes back.

Dear Andrey, to much "may be" in your theory. All I know (from Bhakti, Yoga, esoteric etc) is that there are cases when another fine energy structure (not soul) (they are called rakshas, demons, gosts etc) can influence soul. This influence is based on thoughts, and desires which this structure puts in mind of this man. But I never had heard about 2 souls in one body. If you have source of such information please share.

In BB's case, he received thoughts from Supreme Soul. God can enter anyone (but of course only those who have such role according to drama plan) because He have no fine body, so He don't influence on material body. If I mistake please explain me. Mind is open for information.

[bansy]

There seems to be a lot of "maybes".

So "maybe" it is a complete lie/error..... ;-)

But lies are simply part of the truth. :laugh:

[mbbhat]

As far as I know(according to BK's and to my common sense) Dadi Gulzar's soul (in her fine body) leaves her material body and stays in the Subtle Region while BB's soul (in his fine body) enters Dadi Gulzar material body. Supreme Soul also comes at the moment or may be a little bit later. After that BB leaves her body and she comes back.

2) But I never had heard about 2 souls in one body. If you have sourse of such information please share.

I think most of the BKs(including me) believe that Gulzar Dadi's soul will be present in her own body even while BapDada's entrance. It just goes to sleep during that period.

2)Even in lowkik, it is said that a ghost can enter a body. According to them the original soul does not leave.

Something:- Baba says in Murli that sometimes the dead person's(the one who just died) soul is invited in a Braahmin's body and his relatives speak to that soul.

At present my belief is:-
The new soul can just stay in the body without disturbing the other (original) soul. Sometimes it may take control of the organs. Sometimes both the souls may fight with each other. It is like two persons living in a house.

I have heard some incidents/experiences by BKs as well as lowkik people.

[shivshankar]

1)I think most of the BKs(including me) believe that Gulzar Dadi's soul will be present in her own body even while BapDada's entrance. It just goes to sleep during that period.
2)Even in lowkik, it is said that a ghost can enter a body. According to them the original soul does not leave.
At present my belief is:-
The new soul can just stay in the body without disturbing the other (original) soul. Sometimes it may take control of the organs. Sometimes both the souls may fight with each other. It is like two persons living in a house.
I have heard some incidents/experiences by BKs as well as lowkik people.

1) I am quiet shure that BK teacher in my city had explained me that mechanism (and it has common sense from the logical point of view IMHO of course). I mean that Dadis soul stays in the Subtle Region during BapDada's entrance. Just remembered: this teacher told, that when Dadi returns from the subtle she always asks about what was Baba talking about?
2) Many ghosts are not souls, but just some more simple structures with their aims and abilities. They can enter the body, but it is different case.

As for two souls in one body. Is there any information in the Murlis on that issue?

[andrey]

There is mention in the Murlis about evil spirits. It is said that we are responsible to make these evil spirits good. If they enter us, this is for their benefit,they should obey us, we should not obey them.

There seems to be a lot of "maybes".

There are lot of "maybes" because i' m seeker as everyone and cannot present my mind as final truth. Whatever is from the Murli everyone knows. The fact that on one question there are 2,3,4 opinions means there is ignorance. There can be only one knowledge, even if these souls exist or not, how they exist etc., there can be only one correct answer and this information is not our property. We think about it.

But lies are simply part of the truth.

Lies are part of the world. In the world there are lies and there is truth. in the absolute reality there are two. Anyway they can both exist only together, in comparison. We even say the land of truth, the land of falsehood, but maybe in this not everything is 100% true or false. 100% truth is one and everything else is in percentage less. Truth is like the complete light, white, right, and lie is like the darkness, black, wrong. So one is not part of the other but they coexist and we can separate them, but there is a difference. In white light all colors are there and light has a source. Darkness is just lack of light, so lie is like twisted truth. This is why it is said that truth comes only through one mouth and everyone else repeats it and lies a little.

[mbbhat]

SM 5-4-78(2):- Yah to tum jaante ho hum aatma Paramdhaam se aate hain. Garbhjail may jaakar phir chola dhaaran kar hum part bajaakar aatee hain. Abhi part pooraa huva hai. Phir yah sharir chod nangaa hokar jaanaa hai.

=You know that we souls come from Paramdham. (First) we go into garbh_jail, then wear dress(body), then play part and then come out(!). Now the part is finished. Then this body should be shed, become nude(bodyless) and go (to Paramdham).

Are entering garbh_jail and wearing dress different processes?
Is the playing of part is just inside the garbh(womb)? ["Part bajaakar aate hain"= We come after playing the part!]

If my translation is mistake, please correct.

[arjun]

If my translation is mistake, please correct.

Yes, I think the translation does not appear to be correct. What Baba wants to say in that line is that souls come from the Soul World, enter the jail-like womb, wear the dress-like body, play their parts (after coming out of the womb) and then come back to the Soul World.

[mbbhat]

1)Yes, I think the translation does not appear to be correct. 2)What Baba wants to say in that line is that souls come from the Soul World, enter the jail-like womb, wear the dress-like body, play their parts (after coming out of the womb) and then come back to the Soul World.

Dear Arjun Soul,
1)will you please explain how it is wrong?

Is not entering the jail same as wearing the dress?

And then part bajaakar aate hain :- From where we come after playing the part?

2)I also mean the same in my mind and intellect.
Thank You for reminding me the sweet home.

[mbbhat]

SM 14-1-76(1):- Aise nahin ki saare Satyug may 1250 varsh tak ek LN hee raajy karte hain. Nahin. EK2 150 VARSH RAAJY KARTE HAIN. PHIR VAARIS KO DETE HAIN.

= It is not that in the whole Satyug(Golden Age), just one LN will rule. EACH RULES FOR 150 years. Then they handover (the power or Kingdom) to vaaris(heir, here son).

Does each one rules for 150 years(full life span)? This is impossible.

OK, let as agree. Then when one King handovers power to his son, what would be his age? How the second King rules for 150 years?

[mbbhat]

SM 22-4-2009(3):- Tum jante ho jaisa karm hum karte hain unko aisaa phal milta hai. Jaise koyi hospital banate hain to doosrey janm may unki aayu badi aur tandurusth honge. Koyi dharm_shala, school banate hain, to unko AADHAA KALP ka sukh milta hai.

= You know that we get fruit according to our actions. If one builds hospital, in the next birth he gets long life and his health will be good. Some build dharmshala, some school. They get happiness for half a Kalpa.

Baba usually says the fruit for such actions is for just one birth. The how come for half a Kalpa?

[arjun]

Baba usually says the fruit for such actions is for just one birth. The how come for half a Kalpa?

I doubt the authenticity of the Murli. It would be better if we can check the original version of the Sakar Murli.

[shivsena]

For the coming of souls from Paramdham it is said that matter attracts soul.

Please explain how can inert matter on earth attract an inert soul from Paramdham.(who is living in sweet silent home with beloved bindi Father Shiva)

[mbbhat]

SM 21-7-81(1):- Jab nirakari aatmaayein bhi sharir may jati hain toh garbh may aati hain. Phir punarjanm leti hain. BAAP SAMJHAATE HAIN TUMNEY 84 JANM GARBH SE LIYE HAIN. Ek sharir chod phir garbh may jate ho. AISE 84 JANM LIYE. Main toh garbh may nahin aataa hun. -127

=When incorporeal souls enter body, they enter the womb. Then they take rebirth. Father explains, you have taken 84 births through womb. You leave one body and then enter womb. In this way you have taken 84 births. I do not come into womb.

How come 84 births through womb? I think Baba says approximately here. This may be a way of teaching of Baba.

SM 1-5-81(3):- Sanyasiyon ko bhi vicar se paidaa hona padta hai. Phir Sanyasi bante hain. Phir anth mati so gati ho jati hai. Vah sanskaar ley jate hain. PHIR CHOTE_PAN MAY HI SANATAN DHARM MAY CHALE JATE HAIN. Jaise ladayivaalon kaa misaal Baba samjhate hain. Bahut shaastr padhey huye hain to anth mati so gati ho jati hai. Phir chote_pan may hi kanth kar lete hain. -2, 4.

=Sanyasis also need to take birth through vices. Then they become sanyasis(saints). Then it becomes anth mati so gati(as the last stage of mind so is the status). They take with them that sanskaar(resolves). THEN IN THE SMALL AGE ITSELF THEY MOVE INTO SANATAN RELIGION. Baba gives examples of soldiers. Those who have read a lot about scriptures attain/get anth mati so gati stage. ...

Can the religion of sanyasis be called as sanatan religion?

[andrey]

1) why approximately. Some souls take exactly 84 births through womb. What it is that you find disturbing here?

2) those sanyasis go to the sanathan dharma, who used to belong to the sanathan dharma in golden and silver ages and got converted, then when it is the Confluence Age again, they return.

[mbbhat]

1)...
2) those sanyasis go to the sanathan dharma, who used to belong to the sanathan dharma in golden and silver ages and got converted, then when it is the Confluence Age again, they return.

1)Nothing is disturbing dear Soul. It is said You have taken 84 births through womb. Usually YOU stands for those who are sitting in front of Baba or those to whom Baba is teaching to reach highest aim. All those who sit in front of Baba or those who reach high aim need not take 84 births through womb. So I mentioned the word approximate.

Not only that some may take even 85 births through womb(those who take braahmin life for 2 or three births). But Baba has never mentioned 85. That is why I wrote the word approximate.

2)But it is said THEN IN THE SMALL AGE ITSELF THEY MOVE INTO SANATAN RELIGION. ...

Dear Andrey Soul,

One more sentence in the point says Phir chote_pan may hi kanth kar lete hain. [Approx. translation= Then in childhood itself they easily master/by heart all the mantras of scriptures)

What is the meaning of In small age(or childhood) they move into sanatan religion and in childhood they kanth kar lete hain?

At what age they move into sanatan religion and at what age they kanth kar lete hain?

So do you say the sanyasi souls who take birth in Golden and Silver Age do not belong to to sanatan religion by birth? They move into sanatan religion in their childhood. Is there any scripture in sanatan religion in Golden and Silver Age? [/color]