Consciousness: Soul-based or Body-based

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amaranthine
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Joined: 02 Jun 2006

Consciousness: Soul-based or Body-based

Post by amaranthine »

At the request of ex-l (in the 'is it true about Dadiji thread) I thought I would start this topic. To start the ball rolling here is my understanding.

For me dementia does not necessarily prove that consciousness is brain based. To explain this I will use that classic Hindi explanation, the driver and the car (sorry!). With dementia I see the body being like a malfunctioning car. The Driver (soul) may turn the wheel to the right but the car goes to the left or the driver may apply the brakes but the boot opens instead. However as the windows of the car begin to malfunction too (perception/insight) the driver may not always be aware that anything is wrong, sometimes they will be.

If you were to speak to an aphasic individual you might think their consciousness had completely melted away or if you watched an apraxic individual perform everyday tasks you might think their consciousness was equally lost - in both these instances this would be an incorrect assumption. Granted aphasia and apraxia are not quite the same as dementia but they are brain based conditions.

I would say that the brain is needed for us to express our consciousness in this physical world and when the brain is faulty this consciousness is unable to be expressed. Do we have consciousness in the Soul World (if you believe in that place)? If you believe in subtle/astral regions does that non-physical body have a consciousness?

So for me physical consciousness it a combination of both soul and brain.

What I do find interesting though are sanskars and karma for individuals who have had a personality changing brain injury. Is the new personality due to dormant sankars or is it due to the faulty car? If it is due to the faulty car and the peaceful intentions of the soul end up being aggressive does that then create aggressive sankars and negative karma for the individual’s next birth? If it does it seems a bit unfair to me!
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zhuk
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Joined: 11 Jul 2006
Affinity to the BKWSU: ex-BK

Post by zhuk »

For me, its pretty well brain-based. If you've had close contact with anyone with dementia, they eventually become, for want of a better phrase a completely empty vessel....really there's no one at home - without memory you cannot have any sense of self.

At least that's how I see it. But I have to be brutally honest & admit that I may be unconsciously wanting to believe that to protect myself from pain, having seen a loved relative go through the process and not want to acknowledge that there is some remnant self trapped inside a disintegrating mind....which would be an unbearable prospect.

so I could always be wrong :P But the whole issue is a non-issue for me anyway really...I've ceased even bothering whether anyone even has a soul at all :D
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jamesy
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Joined: 04 Jun 2006

Post by jamesy »

zhuk wrote:so I could always be wrong But the whole issue is a non-issue for me anyway really...
I’m glad Zuck more or less talked himself out of his position, because I just don’t get his argument at all. Where as I’ve always liked Amaranthine’s car & driver analogy, still do actually, but I’m doubtful if liking the sound of it proves anything. Good news though, as there has over the past 20 years, been an extensive amount of research carried out mostly be reputable academics, that provide strong supporting evidence for reincarnation.

Key areas of analysis include:
  • (i) near death experience
    (ii) very young children remembering verifiable circumstances from a previous life
    (iii) Hypnotic regression
I've recently read "The book of the Soul" by Ian Lawton, http://www.ianlawton.com which correlates the work of a considerable number of the leading researchers in these fields. It’s a damn fine read, in that you clearly see the impressive uniformity of experience that these different sources are documenting.
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zhuk
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Post by zhuk »

^^ :lol: hell, I don't really get my argument either :P
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jamesy
ex-BK
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Joined: 04 Jun 2006

Post by jamesy »

zhuk wrote:hell, I don't really get my argument either :P
Glad you're relaxed about it Zhuk mate. The way I see it, if a bit of honest argy bargy can help give someone back their soul then this forums served its purpose.
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