BK-PBK.Info - for BKs & PBKs or BKWSU & AIVV Supporters, Children, Students & Disciples
Discussion of ShivBaba's Knowledge & 'Advanced Knowledge', suited for EVERYONE associated with 'PrajaPita Brahma Kumaris Spiritual Godly World University-cum-Hospital'.
An open forum for all ex-BKs, BKs, PBKs, ex-PBKs, Vishnu Party and ALL other Splinter Groups to post their queries to, and debate with, any member of any group congenially.
Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: to know the truth about, ' who is narrating Murlis and Vanis' and what is the message in Murli and Vanis in code form.
Avaykt Vani 16-7-69 says: "Ab Gyan surya vyakt kinara chod avaykt vatan mein khade hain". ["Now the Sun of Knowledge has left the corporeal world and is standing in the subtle avaykt world."]
Who is this Gyan-surya who is waiting for the children in avaykt vatan ???
The above Vani point clearly proves that there is no soul playing the role of Gyan-surya in vyakt-vatan(corporeal world) as is taught by Advanced Knowledge.....if Veerendra Dev Dixit is playing the role of Gyan-surya( as claimed by PBKs) then why did avaykt Brahma make the above statement in july 1969 when Veerendra Dev Dixit had not even entered the Yagya.
Dear Shivsena,
You have rightly said that Om-Radhey-Mama is Sun of Knowledge. It is also mentioned in the following Murli point
Murli dated 20.11.2012 says,:"There is great praise of the Kumaris. Mama is the main one. That one is the Sun of Knowledge and this one is the incognito Mama . Hardly anyone understands this secret. The temples that have been created are also to that Mama. There is no temple to this incognito old Mama. We are the mother and Father in the combined form."
Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: I have been associated with Raj Yoga since 1985, and have only quite recently come to learn of the PBKs and this forum, which i find a great place to get deeper insights into all things Gyani, and hear input from many sides. I find this most healthy, stimulating, and informative, and hope this continues for some time to come.
shivachild wrote:Murli dated 20.11.2012 says,:"There is great praise of the Kumaris. Mama is the main one. That one is the Sun of Knowledge and this one is the incognito Mama . Hardly anyone understands this secret. The temples that have been created are also to that Mama. There is no temple to this incognito old Mama. We are the mother and Father in the combined form."
This is my interpretation of this point...
"There is great praise of the Kumaris. Mama(Jagadamba Gita Mata is the main one). That one(Prajapita-Ram)is the Sun of Knowledge and this one(Brahma Baba Krishna) is the incognito Mama . Hardly anyone understands this secret. The temples that have been created are also to that Mama(Jagadamaba Gita Mata). There is no temple to this incognito old Mama. We(Prajapita-Ram and Brahma Baba Krishna) are the mother and Father in the combined form(Ardhanarishwar)." [Mu 20.11.12]
Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: to know the truth about, ' who is narrating Murlis and Vanis' and what is the message in Murli and Vanis in code form.
Roy wrote:
This is my interpretation of this point... "There is great praise of the Kumaris. Mama(Jagadamba Gita Mata is the main one). That one(Prajapita-Ram)is the Sun of Knowledge and this one(Brahma Baba Krishna) is the incognito Mama . Hardly anyone understands this secret." [Mu 20.11.12]
Dear Roy,
Avaykt Vani 16-7-69 says: "Ab Gyan surya vyakt kinara chod avaykt vatan mein khade hain". ["Now the Sun of Knowledge has left the corporeal world and is standing in the subtle avaykt world."] So, Sun of Knowledge is 'Avyakt' before 1969. It is definitely not Baba Virendra Dev Dixit.
Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: To exchange views with past and present members of BKWSU and its splinter groups.
shivachild wrote:Avaykt Vani 16-7-69 says: "Ab Gyan surya vyakt kinara chod avaykt vatan mein khade hain". ["Now the Sun of Knowledge has left the corporeal world and is standing in the subtle avaykt world."]
So, Sun of Knowledge is 'Avyakt' before 1969. It is definitely not Baba Veerendra Dev Dixit.
You think that the Subtle Region is somewhere above the Sun, the Moon and the stars whereas we PBKs think that the Subtle Region is here. By the way you appear on this forum as a PBK but most of your views are against the stated views of PBKs. May I please know the reason for this difference in opinion with the PBKs while retaining the title of a PBK?
Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: To exchange views with past and present members of BKWSU and its splinter groups.
Avaykt Vani 16-7-69 says: Ab Gyan surya vyakt kinara chod avaykt vatan mein khade hain". ["Now the Sun of Knowledge has left the corporeal world and is standing in the subtle avaykt world."]
So, Sun of Knowledge is 'Avyakt' before 1969. It is definitely not Baba Veerendra Dev Dixit
you join the PBKs on the pretext of supporting Baba Dixit but actually your intention is to denigrate Baba Dixit. Since you are using the anonymous name 'Shivachild', and if you are really a child of Shiva,then ask yourself, do you have any sincerity in you?
Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: to know the truth about, ' who is narrating Murlis and Vanis' and what is the message in Murli and Vanis in code form.
arjun wrote:You think that the Subtle Region is somewhere above the Sun, the Moon and the stars whereas we PBKs think that the Subtle Region is here. By the way you appear on this forum as a PBK but most of your views are against the stated views of PBKs. May I please know the reason for this difference in opinion with the PBKs while retaining the title of a PBK?
Dear PBK brother Arjun, I do not want to retain the title of PBK in this forum. Kindly tell me the process of changing the title in this forum. I want to be appear as an ex-PBK , but I could not find that option in the user control panel.
if Subtle Region is here then what is the meaning of 'Avyakt' in Murlis/Vanis? And how Baba Virendra Dev Dixit is Avyakt before 1969?
At present Baba Virendra Dev Dixit is in subtle form or corporeal form? Please explain.
Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: I have been associated with Raj Yoga since 1985, and have only quite recently come to learn of the PBKs and this forum, which i find a great place to get deeper insights into all things Gyani, and hear input from many sides. I find this most healthy, stimulating, and informative, and hope this continues for some time to come.
shivachild wrote:Avaykt Vani 16-7-69 says: "Ab Gyan surya vyakt kinara chod avaykt vatan mein khade hain". ["Now the Sun of Knowledge has left the corporeal world and is standing in the subtle avaykt world."] So, Sun of Knowledge is 'Avyakt' before 1969. It is definitely not Baba Virendra Dev Dixit.
Dear Shivachild Bhai... sorry for the delay in my response
Here are a few points about this subject, that have my interpretations in brackets, based on my studies of Advance Knowledge...
“The Father explains – I come and grant true salvation(sadgati) to everyone (in the form of Ram ShivBaba - Shiv+Prajapita-Ram) . I come (at this time, before 1968/9) by entering in this one (and tell you true Brahmins - not those sitting before Me - about these matters, that will occur in the future). This Brahma(Baba Krishna) is corporeal (until 1968/9); then this very Brahma(Baba Krishna) becomes a Subtle Region dweller angel(i.e. he takes on a subtle body, in 1968/9). That one(Prajapita-Ram aka Shankar - who is revealed to a few Brahmins, in 1976) is Avyakt(i.e. has a subtle intellect - he churns on the Murlis intensely, for 5-6 years, between 1970 and 1976)... this one(Brahma Baba Krishna) is vyakt(i.e. has a corporeal or inert intellect - the Bull - he does not churn on the points of knowledge in the Murli - his intellect is child-like - the child Krishna).” [Mu 13.01.10]
"Do you think that we should also leave the body and become Avyakt (like Brahma Baba Krishna did, in 1968/9)? Do not follow in this matter. Father Brahma(Prajapita-Ram, after intensely studying the Murli for 5-6 years, from 1969/70) became Avyakt (i.e. renounced the corporeal world intellectually, whilst still in the body, in 1976) so that you could see the example of the (practical) Avyakt form, and follow easily." [Av 13.03.81]
"Ask those false Brahmins(of the Confluence Age, who haven't yet recognised the incognito part of Father, being played through the corporeal Father, Prajapita-Ram, since 1969/70) - If you are (true or complete) Brahmins, if you call yourselves mouth-born Brahmins, then who is your Father Brahma (who should be here with you in practical corporeal form, until the end)?” [Mu 08.12.84]
"Now the Sun of Knowledge(Prajapita-Ram) has left the corporeal world(i.e. he begins churning the knowledge in the Murlis, from 1969/70) and is standing in the subtle avaykt world (i.e. his mind and intellect become subtle, detached from the concerns of the corporeal world)." [Av 16.07.69]
"Subtle Region is created for 50 years (commencing in 1969/70, when Prajapita-Ram aka Shankar starts churning Gyan)." [Av 15.03.70]
"When the Iron Age ends (in the intellect of Prajapita-Ram, in 1976, as a result of studying the Murli for 5-6 years, from 1969/70), then Bhakti would also end (for him first of all)... only then will God (Shiva) come and meet (in the form of the Father, through him) because He(Ram ShivBaba) alone gives the fruits of Bhakti (by revealing the deep secrets locked within the Sakar Murlis, that allow the accurate churning of Gyan to commence for the true Brahmins, or PBKs). He (Prajapita-Ram) is called the Sun of Knowledge. The Moon of knowledge, the Sun of Knowledge and the lucky stars of knowledge. OK, the (corporeal) Father (Prajapita-Ram) is the Sun of Knowledge (i.e. this role is played through Prajapita Brahma, from 1976, by Father Shiv). Then the mother (Brahma Baba Krishna) should be the Moon of knowledge. So, the body (of Brahma Baba Krishna) in which He (Shiv) has entered (at this time, before 1969) is the Moon of knowledge mother (Incognito Jagadamaba), and the rest of the children are lucky stars. In this way, Jagdamba(Om Radhe Mama) is also a lucky star because she is also a child, isn’t she? Even among the stars, one (Prajapita-Ram aka Shankar) shines the most. Similarly, even here they are numberwise. Those are the Sun, the Moon and the stars of the sky, and here it is a matter of knowledge(Shankar is no 1 in knowledge). Just as they are the rivers of water and these (children) are the rivers of knowledge, which have emerged from the Ocean of Knowledge (Father Shiv, and will all merge with Him at the end)." [Mu 11.01.08]
"Everything will be clear, when the Sun of Knowledge rises." (Father Shiv plays this part, through Prajapita-Ram from 1976 - the part of Moon of Knowledge is played through Brahma Baba Krishna) [Mu 22.01.70]
"Moon's quality is to radiate cool light." [Mu 15.09.69]
"This one (Brahma Baba Krishna) is the moon (of knoweldge mother) of the Sun of Knowledge(Father, Ram ShivBaba - Shiv+Prajapita-Ram)... but because he is male, the urn is placed on the mother(Mama Saraswati)." [Mu 05.09.08]
"We get a post in Sun Dynasty through (Prajapita)Brahma(Ram) (because Brahma Baba Krishna is not here in corporeal form to give it)." [Av 19.12.72 ]
"ShivBaba(Father Shiv) is subtle(incorporeal). Similarly Shankar(Prajapita-Ram) is also subtle(i.e. he attains the 100% soul conscious or incorporeal stage equal to Father Shiv's by the end of the Confluence Age... hence the name at practical Revelation, of Shiv Shankar Bholenath)." [Mu 29.09.77]
"Father had explained that Prajapita Brahma(Ram), who is a bodily being now(i.e. an effort maker soul)... he only becomes subtle(100% incorporeal, like Father Shiv at the end, whilst remaining in his corporeal body - this is the complete angelic stage of Shankar)." [Mu 23.01.84]
"Angels mean kings of the physical body." [Av 05.02.09]
"I (Ram ShivBaba - the form of the practical Father) come(i.e. am revealed) at the Purushottam Sangamyug of every cycle(i.e. in 1976 - the year of revelation of the Father). In 50-60 years(i.e. 40 years of ordinary Confluence Age + 60 years of Purushottam Confluence Age = 100 years in total), Father(Shiv, in the corporeal body of Prajapita-Ram) comes and teaches(advance knowledge to) His children (from 1976, which is known as the Purushottam Confluence Age - the age for becoming the highest amongst souls, based on the teachings of advance knowlege through Prajapita-Ram) ." [Mu 08.09.68]
"Father(Shiv) comes in the (Purushottam)Confluence Age (commencing in 1976, to play the role of Father), stays in him(Prajapita Brahma aka Ram, the permanent Chariot) for 50-60 years(Brahma Baba Krishna was only the temporary Chariot, between 1947/8 and 1968/9 - 21/22 years), and transforms him." [Av 26.11.72, 29.11.77]
"Ram(ShivBaba)... i.e. Parampita Paramatma(i.e. Shiv+Prajapita-Ram)." [Mu 26.08.13]
“This(1976) is a special year that has been publicized as the year of Revelation (of the Father)... It will happen according to the drama (and) this is fine; but someone does become an instrument(murti). Just as there was the part of the establishment (of the Brahmin Religion or race) in the drama (through the mother Brahma Baba Krishna); but Brahma(Baba Krishna) became an instrument (in 1947/8), didn’t he? He displayed courage, came practically, became an instrument, only then did it happen(i.e. before 1947/8, the Brahmin Religion did not exist, only Om Mandali - there was no BKIVV). Just as Brahma(Baba Krishna) became an instrument in the corporeal form for the establishment... Brahma(Baba Krishna then) became Avyakt(i.e. took on a subtle body, in 1968/9). Now (in 1976), who is the one in the corporeal form to cause the destruction (Shankar aka Prajapita-Ram is known to be the one through whom destruction takes place - i.e. the especially appointed or permanent Chariot of Father Shiv)?” [Av 04.02.76]
"What is the Avyakt meeting? To become the same as the one you are meeting. So, to have an Avyakt meeting means to adopt an Avyakt form, the same as the Father(Prajapita-Ram)'s. Avyakt means where there is no feeling of the corporeal (but whilst remaining in the corporeal body). Have you become like this?" [Av 05.12.74]
"Are all of you sitting in the Avyakt(subtle) form? Whilst in the corporeal form, you have to stabilise yourself in the Avyakt stage." [Av 21.01.69]
"Incorporeal Father(Shiv) also meets the children through avaykt Brahma(i.e. Prajapita aka Shankar - not subtle bodied Brahma Baba Krishna). Incorporeal Father also likes this company of angels very much." [Av 18.01.87]
"(The true Brahmin children) will get the habit of understanding the subtle avaykt talks of avaykt Father(Brahma aka Prjapita-Ram - not Avyakt Brahma Baba Krishna, the true mother, through Dadi Gulzar). These things will be understood in future. How lucky we (true Brahmin) souls are (who have also recognised the true spiritual Father)." [Av 09.10.87]
"The spiritual Father sits and explains to the spiritual children – This one (Brahma Baba Krishna) will not be called the spiritual Father." [Mu 05.06.09]
"I (Shiv) do not enter Brahma(Baba Krishna), the dweller of the Subtle Region." [Mu 04.11.72]
“The incorporeal Father must certainly live in the Supreme Abode(Paramdham), just as you all live with Me. First when I come (at the very beginning of the Confluence Age, in 1936/7), Brahma, Vishnu, Shankar are with me (in corporeal form). The human world is already in existence; then how does it turn, how does it repeat? First of all the subtle (unlimited) world (of the Confluence Age) would have to be created; (so) then one has to come to the corporeal world (in order to do this), because human beings who were deities, have now become shudras. They have to be then transformed from Brahmins to deities (through Prajapita-Ram, from 1976).” [Mu 08.01.08]
"Next to Father(Shiv) is Krishna(Prajapita-Ram). He (Father Shiv) is Master of the Soul World; this (Confluence Age Krishna aka Prajapita-Ram) is the master of the corporeal world. There is nothing in the Subtle Region." [Mu 06.01.76]
“The Subtle Region is nothing.” [Mu 02.12.95]
“The Supreme Soul Shiva creates it (i.e. the Subtle Region, in the mind of souls) in the Confluence Age sometimes, for the purpose of visions.” [Mu 12.03.80]
“The Subtle Region has to be created here (on earth, via our churning of advance knowledge, from 1969).” [Mu 22.11.72]
“You children have created the Subtle Region here (on earth) only (through your spiritual efforts). No Subtle Region exists up there (beyond the corporeal world), where after leaving the mortal coils the souls congregate with their astral bodies(no, they remain here in the corporeal world, and serve via their subtle bodies in the Advance Party).” [Av 22.11.72]
Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: To exchange views with past and present members of BKWSU and its splinter groups.
shivachild wrote:I do not want to retain the title of PBK in this forum. Kindly tell me the process of changing the title in this forum. I want to be appear as an ex-PBK , but I could not find that option in the user control panel.
Thanks for taking a stand. I think Shivsena Bhai will be able to guide you in better way as he is the Admin of this forum and has also changed his status on this forum from PBK to ex-PBK.
if Subtle Region is here then what is the meaning of 'Avyakt' in Murlis/Vanis? And how Baba Veerendra Dev Dixit is Avyakt before 1969?
At present Baba Veerendra Dev Dixit is in subtle form or corporeal form? Please explain.
The unlimited meaning of subtle and Avyakt is almost same. Avyakt stage refers to subtle stage only.
Baba Virendra Dev Dixit was not avyak before 1969.
Baba Virendra Dev Dixit is in corporeal form at present, but making efforts to attain a subtle stage while living in the corporeal body like other PBKs.
Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: to know the truth about, ' who is narrating Murlis and Vanis' and what is the message in Murli and Vanis in code form.
Roy wrote:
"Now the Sun of Knowledge(Prajapita-Ram) has left the corporeal world(i.e. he begins churning The Knowledge in the Murlis, from 1969/70) and is standing in the subtle avaykt world (i.e. his mind and intellect become subtle, detached from the concerns of the corporeal world)." [Av 16.07.69]
Arjun wrote:
Baba Veerendra Dev Dixit was not avyak before 1969.
Baba Veerendra Dev Dixit is in corporeal form at present, but making efforts to attain a subtle stage while living in the corporeal body like other PBKs.
So, who(Sun of Knowledge) was standing in the subtle Avyakt world(left the corporeal world) on 16.07.1969 and waiting for children???
Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: to know the truth about, ' who is narrating Murlis and Vanis' and what is the message in Murli and Vanis in code form.
arjun wrote:Thanks for taking a stand. I think Shivsena Bhai will be able to guide you in better way as he is the Admin of this forum and has also changed his status on this forum from PBK to ex-PBK.
Dear Shivsena,
Thanks! for changing my status from PBK to Ex-PBK on this forum?
Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: I have been associated with Raj Yoga since 1985, and have only quite recently come to learn of the PBKs and this forum, which i find a great place to get deeper insights into all things Gyani, and hear input from many sides. I find this most healthy, stimulating, and informative, and hope this continues for some time to come.
shivachild wrote:So, who(Sun of Knowledge) was standing in the subtle Avyakt world(left the corporeal world) on 16.07.1969 and waiting for children???
Imo, the part of the Sun of Knowledge is played through Virendra Dev Dixit ji... He started churning intensely on the Murlis from 1969/70, and so began entering the subtle stage or subtle Avyakt world, and set the standard from this time forward, for us to follow.
Please give a short description of your interest in joining this forum.: to know the truth about, ' who is narrating Murlis and Vanis' and what is the message in Murli and Vanis in code form.
Roy wrote:
This is my interpretation of this point...
We(Prajapita-Ram and Brahma Baba Krishna) are the mother and Father in the combined form(Ardhanarishwar)." [Mu 20.11.12]
Dear Roy,
As per your interpretation We=soul of Virendra Dev Dixit+soul of Lekhraj Kirpalani;
But this is a Sakar Murli spoken before 1969. Surely, soul of Babab Virendra Dev Dixit was not in the body of Dada Lekhraj Kirpalani when these words were spoken.
BKs think that We=Supreme Soul Shiva(Father)+soul of Lekhraj Kirpalani(Mother)
But, in fact We= soul of Om-Radhey Mama-Saraswati(Father and mother combined)
=No.1 Shivshakti combined with Shiv
