Ideological interpretation of the Yagya History - REVs .

To discuss the BK and PBK versions relating to the progressive differential development of BK & PBK ideologies or theologies.
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Re: Ideological interpretation of the Yagya History - REVISI

Post by warrior »

fluffy bunny wrote:There was no knowledge. 20 odd years ... you could teach it in 3 minutes.
There was no knowledge only magic.
There was magic at Om Niwas
English Murli - 13-12-14 Magic at OM NIWAS.pdf
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Re: Ideological interpretation of the Yagya History - REVISI

Post by fluffy bunny »

warrior wrote:There was no knowledge only magic.
There was magic at Om Niwas
Thanks for posting that.

But when was it revised?

It says,
Every one was made to lie down and told to remember Shiv Baba
And now we know that just cannot be true.

So what were they "remembering" ... or how were the hypnotic trances invoked?
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Re: Ideological interpretation of the Yagya History - REVISI

Post by warrior »

fluffy bunny wrote: So what were they "remembering" ... or how were the hypnotic trances invoked?
It was magical. They would go into trance automatically.

And what else were they doing in Karachi for so long?

It was the initial preparation time factor to overcome the basic inner resistance for the continuous current flow. Just like in the threshold where there is a point at which the current is allowed to flow when the diode is forward-biased.

The chronology of beginning can be linked to basic electronics. Considering the soul as battery( light) to make a logical explanation.

This factual situation also applies to the Godly Gyan Ygya in the beginning or start of knowledge time.

How much effort and time needed or required to go through to compensate and overcome over the added built up, accumulated inner resistance in the form of Sanskars of many births?

A lot of potential energy and purity lost during various rebirth processes hence a considerable voltage of knowledge required as a forward-biased to reach the threshold point for conduction of knowledge to other devices or souls. That initial forward-biased time must be ignored as a justful counting for knowledgeable students/ souls on the basis of understanding study, test or knowledge.

Past is linked with future. The time period for exit. Transit visa from Pakistan to Mount Abu to a relevant conducting journey where the condition of knowledge prevail but no conduction effectively, opening gates consequently of device until a time considering the ability and function of everyone in sight in view of complete whole circuit as a one unit for an optimum result forever in the future as well.

When a continuous flow will occur according to the rule – it looks like a special favor towards few souls but really it is not, it is only a procedure to follow to make the circuit in action in a logical and practical way altogether. A very wide range of diodes (souls) are available, capable of performing many tasks from rectifying AC, in the order of hundreds of amps to high speed logic switching( churning)...

(This is just a sample of the answer given in cooperation of another researcher, when time permits I will conclude).
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Re: Ideological interpretation of the Yagya History - REVISI

Post by sita »

Therefore, when the corrupt and dishonest BK leaders claim to have been "purifying themselves" in the intense bhatti and Beggary Period ... how could they? If you can only purity yourself via accurate remembrance, and they did not know who to remember, how could they purify themselves?
They did not need to remember. They were having the supreme in person. In whatever name or form, clearly Dada Lekhraj represented the supreme for them. They were sitting with him, eating with him. This association was purification.

If it is an impure person will be seen by the results. You will not find moral degradation in people in association with him. A wave of following purity emerged. There is unity among them, personal virtuosity and an atmosphere of peace in the centers, confirmed by almost everyone coming in contact. It may not prove it is God, but there is still a margin for the grand plan of changing the whole world to come true.
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Re: Ideological interpretation of the Yagya History - REVISI

Post by fluffy bunny »

With respect, Sita, I don't think the evidence we have of the early days supports that. I don't think "represented" works.

I would say the disciplines ("purity" is an utterly meaningless word here) were adopted as a response to external pressures and criticisms, certainly as far as Lekhraj Kirpalani goes who was acting in anything but a "pure" manner.

For me, purity of the intellect to see clearly would be a symptom of enlightenment. As far as the BKs go, I would it was more just about unquestioning submission and conformity.
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Re: Ideological interpretation of the Yagya History - REVISI

Post by sita »

I'd agree at some point Brahma Baba was not God, as the messages used to come through other personalities. But then he was God himself and later Chariot of God. So people were lost in his presence. There is no need to recall or remember an experience when you are in the moment of experiencing it.

What do you mean the disciplines were made after external pressure? Do you mean pressure on Brahma Baba from within the Yagya or from society? From within the Yagya maybe, but Brahma Baba cared little about what society says.

There is no evidence someone was rejected from the Yagya at the time of Brahma Baba. He was loose, not authoritarian personality. Maybe later the conformity matter developed with people thirsty for power and position, for to feed their own ego.

The matter of conquering lust is central in the teaching and the practice. This did not come from external pressure for to prove something to society. It is not a new matter, it is there still in the Gita and Gita was the guideline in the beginning. Many used to have read it but something in this sangathan inspired them to believe conquering lust is possible and make effort for it. Many people get inspired by the Bk till day to conquer lust and become pure, in the way they understand it. I don't know about cases that association with the Bk has brought about immoral behavior.

The idea about purity is not meaningless. It has a deep meaning. Different people understand it differently. But there is explicit direction about purity in the teaching and even if it was not following the direction, it was the pure attraction towards Brahma Baba. People saw Krishna in him and they did not like to marry anyone but Krishna. People did not like to marry and those who were married started following celibacy within the marriage, even on the cost of being beaten. And this goes on and we witness it today too. This is the wave of purity. You cannot deny it has come due to the association with the BK and has started there back in the days with Brahma Baba and the other personalities within the Yagya.
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Re: Ideological interpretation of the Yagya History - REVISI

Post by fluffy bunny »

What is the value of not having sex if you still lie, cheat and steal extensively? It does not seem to have done the BKs much good spiritually, although the facade of religiousness has profited them financially and politically.

From the older records we have, all the evidence suggests that Lekhraj Kirpalani's behaviour with the women & girls only changed after external pressure, e.g. separation of male & female, and his exclusion from the female residency.

Also, from Om Radhe, that they considered all their action pure mere on the basis of Lekhraj Kirpalani being their god & Krishna incarnate ... an idea taken from Bhakti.

The Om Mandlites could not have being remembering Shiva as they had zero knowledge of any aspect of him ... ZERO ... and did not right up until the late 1950s. Therefore, they could not have been purifying themselves as they claim.

Surely from a BK point of view, attraction towards Brahma Baba is impure?
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Re: Ideological interpretation of the Yagya History - REVISI

Post by Roy »

fluffy bunny wrote:What is the value of not having sex if you still lie, cheat and steal extensively? It does not seem to have done the BKs much good spiritually, although the facade of religiousness has profited them financially and politically.
Yes, it's one thing not to indulge in sexual relations... it's a very different thing to actually be pure.
fluffy bunny wrote:The Om Mandlites could not have being remembering Shiva as they had zero knowledge of any aspect of him ... ZERO ... and did not right up until the late 1950s. Therefore, they could not have been purifying themselves as they claim.
I agree! Purification takes place through being soul conscious and remembering the Father... but this takes between 40 to 50 years... this is why there is no way Brahma Baba Krishna was karmateet when he left the body, and nor was Mama... This is why they are still playing roles in subtle bodies and striving to reach completion. The complete stage for both souls is when they become Vishnu at the end... this is all stated in the Murlis and i can quote the points if they are requested. The Confluence Age between 1936 to 1976... i.e. 40 years, was the night path... the day began with the revelation of the part of the Father, in 1976... the time when Brahma Baba was entering Virendra Dev Dixit ji and experiencing the seed stage... something he was not achieving whilst in his own body. This also corresponds with the date set for the destruction of the world, which was fortold in 1966, ten years earlier. It all ties in together if you are willing to accept what has been said in the Murlis.
fluffy bunny wrote:Surely from a BK point of view, attraction towards Brahma Baba is impure?
Yes, it is body consciousness! Baba told the children to not even keep a picture of Brahma Baba as nothing is received either from or through him(other than the Murli of course)... the actual inheritance that true Brahmins strive for, is received through another soul, another part that comes later... this is the part that correspnds to the day of knowledge when it starts to become more deeply understood... the part the the BK Yagya try so hard to supress, so that they can keep the BK institution running and expanding which is done largely through deceit and lies.

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Re: Ideological interpretation of the Yagya History - REVISI

Post by sita »

There is also this interpretation that in 76 it was only the corporeal Father who got revealed. It was when the foreigners celebrate the new day at 12 o'clock when it is still dark. So the Sun of Knowledge was not revealed at that time. If we take 76 as the start, we add 40 years to that.
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Re: Ideological interpretation of the Yagya History - REVISI

Post by Roy »

sita wrote:There is also this interpretation that in 76 it was only the corporeal Father who got revealed. It was when the foreigners celebrate the new day at 12 o'clock when it is still dark. So the Sun of Knowledge was not revealed at that time. If we take 76 as the start, we add 40 years to that.
The corporeal Father is the corporeal Sun of Knowledge... and he began to rise(i.e. he is recognised by the foreigner souls to begin with), in 1976... i.e. just after 12 o'clock midnight. The sun then rises to its highest point in 2018, when there will be the revelation to the whole world of the incorporeal and corporeal Sun of Knowledge together... i.e. Shivjayanti!... But this can only happen when the moon of knowledge Brahma has become full(i.e. complete - Brahma so Vishnu - through Brahma Baba's final acceptance and recognition of the practical part/role of the God of the Gita - i.e. Shiv Shankar Bholenath - i.e. the combination of the incorporeal and corporeal Sun of Knowledge) and thus the night of Brahma(Baba Krishna) is finally over, for all of us.

I would argue that the 40 years does not apply to the revelation... but to the 40 years of the ordinary Confluence Age(i.e. 1936 to 1976) when the basic knowledge was taught, through which no-one became fully enlightened. However, Baba has said it takes 50 years to become enlightened or complete, and the student this point applies to is Brahma Baba Krishna... and the starting point for this period, was 1968/9, after he left the body... which when we add 50 years to it... gives us the year, 2018.

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Re: Ideological interpretation of the Yagya History - REVISI

Post by warrior »


The Om Mandlites could not have being remembering Shiva as they had zero knowledge of any aspect of him ... ZERO ...
Yes 'almost zero'.

I say almost coz they had some knowledge but they did not bother to keep it safe, they did not care for it.
They threw that bit of knowledge into a pit.

And in that way they did the shooting for the Golden Age where there will be no knowledge, no study.
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Re: Ideological interpretation of the Yagya History - REVISI

Post by sita »

What is the value of not having sex if you still lie, cheat and steal extensively? It does not seem to have done the BKs much good spiritually, although the facade of religiousness has profited them financially and politically.
Not having sex is not just something when it is about your own wife or husband. It makes a difference to you.
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Re: Ideological interpretation of the Yagya History - REVISI

Post by fluffy bunny »

Well, it has obviously made no difference to the BKs ... except making the richer by appearing to be religious.

It more just about fitting into Indian society, and social climbing ... find acceptance amongst conservative elements.

The BKs are like chameleons, parasitic chameleons who change their look and sound to suit whichever environment benefits them.
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Re: Ideological interpretation of the Yagya History - REVISI

Post by sita »

Roy wrote:The corporeal Father is the corporeal Sun of Knowledge... i
some recent points

In 76 it was the birth of Lakshmi and Narayan, not Shivjayanti. Before this no one knew about the soul of Ram, after that year it gets revealed. In some way he is the ocean of knowledge, who is stuck to the earth, but the Sun of Knowledge, who always resides high, the truth does not get revealed. It will be revealed only after Shivratri. First is Shivratri, the deepest darkness of ignorance, it is not at 12 o'clock, but just before dawn, when all has become false even Ram and Krishna.

In the darkness of ignorance the ears and minds of children will be full of defamation. In the way Brahmins created through Brahma Baba proved to be false, in the same way PBK are also to be proven false. The stone intellect has been made to believe ShivBaba has come. (They put God even in the stones) Some say the knowledge that has been given is extraordinary, but everything is there in the scriptures.

When it will be Shivjayanti it will be that whoever listens, whoever sees will say my Baba has come, not the Baba of the BK. When a child is born it can be seen and there cannot be the question whether it has been born or not. When God comes he will establish kingdom immediately. Maybe here we can add it is Trimurti Shivjayanti, we have one murti missing. Then it is Gitajayanti (of the true Gita), then Krishnajayanti.

When I was in Vijay Vihar, one day after class the question was asked to all. When did the Father come? Did he come or did he not come? Everyone gave his answer. Later a brother was able to ask Baba about it and the answer was along the above points, that it has not come. There are many such skeptical points in the recent classes.
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Re: Ideological interpretation of the Yagya History - REVISI

Post by sita »

Shivjayanti is also the birth of the children. Father and children get birth together. We have not taken birth so Shivjayanti has not come.
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