The Philosophy of Truth

[fluffy bunny]

One of the academics studying the BKs pointed out that despite the changing shopfronts (and he did not know of all the changes we have documented), the inner core of the BKWSU remained unchanged and unrepentant. This is a true statement in my opinion.

I do not even believe the idea of the Om Mandli being a holy counterpoint to the prevailing evils of the Bhaibund community. In my opinion, on the basis of the evidence we have of what they produced, that is another later guise.

So, I think we have to strip away the word "Truth" from our vocabulary with regards the BKWSU. Ditto "Knowledge". Mostly, it is not "knowlege" but anti-knowledge. An analog for real knowledge or understanding that plugs the gaps and shuts down thinking, entertains the mind at a specific and, frankly, not very deep level. I see it as a mental or spiritual cap to further development.

What is the evidence we have from those that have been practising it for all these years?

[alladin]

I see it as a mental or spiritual cap to further development.

And I felt that way, especially in the beginning. It was horrible. Part of me was drawn to Gyan; since it mostly made sense to me, the apparent purity of intentions of those who ran the place and the "Yagya", the semplicity of the centers where meditation courses were given free of charge, the whole vibration, the idea that God actually found me and brought me there. Part of me was rebelling; even during this "Honeymoon Period" to the claustrophobic, stifling feelings the disciplines, systems, expectations from sisters-in-charge and SS were having on me, giving me no time to enjoy bliss.

So, it was like a cap, a hood or a lid over the head. No wonder many BKs have suicidal feelings. A common denominator, apart from all complicated internal conflicts could be this suffocating feeling, the misinterpretation of what a constructive "dying alive" should be (freeing the self from compulsions, addictions and old patterns).

[bro neo]

True that, paulkershaw.

[tinydot]

Here are some Bible verses quoting some lies to justify the glorification of God.

• BIBLE PREACHES UNTRUTH, VEDAS PREACH TRUTH

[fluffy bunny]

Bible verses quoting some lies to justify the glorification of God.

Jahweh, just another trumped up tribal god with megalomaniac world domination plans ... perhaps humanity is just one step down a 'psychic foodchain' to such invisible predators? Or perhaps we just make up our gods in our own image?

• To update the concept, the modus operandi is the same ... "if one's lies enhances the glory and truthfulness of a god, one must resort to it and it should not be judged as bad karma".

[andrey]

Will we be able to perceive truth if our mind is subject to duality, if today we think this way and tomorrow the other way? If we can have faith and lose it?

In the Murli it is said truth is whatever happens in practical. But facts do not speak. They need interpretation. Two people will see two things in one thing. Can there be truth where there is difference? If there is only on thing - this will be truth.

Will we add more knowledge with more information or will we add more confusion? Will more points of view bring more clarity or more doubt?

Can there be one such attitude that is above duality?

[paulkershaw]

Can there be one such attitude that is above duality?

I doubt it - as long as there are teachings of duality (and more), humanity will always have this kind of attitude ... the attitude of duality is a learnt thing, from our peers, parents and teachers and by what the BKWSU are saying and teaching; from God too ...

[fluffy bunny]

Will we be able to perceive truth if our mind is subject to duality

If our mind is clear it becomes a perfect mirror and will reflect truth which is one.

It is our responsibility to be constantly putting aside our subjectivity and self-interest. Truth is, we are not. We must just let go of all that which is not.

[john]

In the Murli it is said truth is whatever happens in practical.

Yes, and the Divine Decrees were written and printed. It was done in practical. It happened.

Now Andrey, where do you stand in this early literature debate , which include the Divine Decrees?

• 1. Do you think they are genuine?
  2. Do you think Virendra Dev Dixit could have made a mistake?
  3. When do you think the idea of Shiva entering BB came into the Yagya, as opposed to him thinking himself to be God?

If you wish to answer, could you do it in a simple straight forward manner please?

[andrey]

Dear brother John,

Please, understand that i have no way to have any knowledge about your questions. from your posts i can see that you are hardly content with interpretations and look for the truth, so i don't think what i can tell you will be something more than personal view, if this will have any value for you. I have no other source of information except the Murli and the Murli clarification, and little bk literature i have read. I don't have access to any hidden sources and any hidden knowledge, that is not common to all. All I know is already this that is well known to all.

I don't undertsand completely what do you mean with divine decrees being genuine. If you ask whether i think there is genuine knowledge in them yes. If you ask whether i think they are genuine documents and not falsificates yes.

I also don't understand what do you mean with that Virendra Dev Dixit has made a mistake. Which mistake he has made that you mean. If you mean about that there is no literature from the beginning of the Yagya i think as Arjun Bhai that Baba via Virendra Dev Dixit means the very early days, before Karachi. As you also know by my posts I am not impartial regarding the knowledge given through Baba via Virendra Dev Dixit, so i cannot give you an impartial answer to the question

Do you think Veerendra Dev Dixit could have made a mistake?

Although at some places i feel astonished by the knowledge he gives, my pursuit is to think it out well before i condemn. I am surely convinced considerable part of the distance created by the knowledge is due to some suspisiosness - a quality i have no need to possess. For my own safety i have chosen to open up and abandon the distrust to only one source, because based on my past experiences i have come to conclusion that all are givers of sorrow. Ultimately, I try to accept whatever he says.

I have no idea about the third question. I personally am not interested in this issue. For you who are interested i can say that the question put in such a way and a research made in this direction can find some proof somewhere and the answer may com as such and such an year. For me this information is not of any value.

I think as a whole this whole process is not done with the real desire for to know a reality, but to dismagify (from magic - to remove the magic) from something covered by the cover of magic of God's work and present it as occult, cultural, social, economical etc phenomena rather than Godly and spiritual phenomena. In fact, i think this is not your pursuit but rather ex-l's whom you follow.

[john]

I think the Divine decrees are possibly one of the most important finds. I think Virendra Dev Dixit is bluffing and doesn't know the answers regarding the information revealed in them. Because he has followers who will just accept his word without question, like yourself, he can get away with this. If Virendra Dev Dixit doesn't know the answers, then how can it be Shiva God Father giving the answers, unless of course Shiva does not know the answers.

As you also know by my posts I am not impartial regarding the knowledge given through Baba via Veerendra Dev Dixit, so I cannot give you an impartial answer to the question

It will feel like force truth obtained through force.

Does this mean you are prepared to lie or give distorted information?

I think as a whole this whole process is not done with the real desire for to know a reality, but to dismagify (from magic - to remove the magic) form something covered by the cover of magic of Gods work and present it as occult, cultural, social, economical etc. phenomena rather than Godly and spiritual phenomena.

Dear brother Andrey

I swear to you 100%, this pursuit is to find the truth and to help others find it. I believe it is only the foundation of truth which cannot be destroyed and that is the magic.

[andrey]

It is not correct to swear to me. It is like holding me responsible for what you do.

One is supposed to speak the truth in front of the court. In other cases, it is unduly. You cannot expect that i speak the truth if you are not a judge. There is no need to press people. If you do there will be objection. If you expect that truth will come out of my mouth I am not the mouth out of which the truth will come out. For myself i just accept that i cannot find the truth on my own and speak it to others. I can only learn it and repeat it. If you are to prove people lying, giving distorted informatin etc, still you should point the law we cross doing this and the sentence we are to expect.

If you say Godfather Shiva is not giving the answers, Virendra Dev Dixit is bluffing and does not know, and you spread this information, then understand that there cannot be objection to this. I cannot be hold responsible for what he says. There cannot be objection even when one accepts words just like that. On the contrary. To say that there is no one whose every word is true is to say there is no one 100% truthful i.e. there is no God. This is also fine. To the extent i can accept words just like that and spread them i can of course be held responsible, but still there cannot be objection to it as it does not cross any written or unwritten law. I think it is just the way it should be.

If you have objection then you could report me to someone who will hold me responsible. Some authority to reform me. Otherwise, i see no margin to accept objections by someone just like that. Similarly i have no right to demand certain behaviour from other, but as far as we meet in our discussion in the form of the guilty one in front of the one who speaks the truth you may expect that i have to bow down to your truthfulness, but i would rather remain untruthful to someone who will accept me just like that. What i can tell is that Avyakt BapDada has said in the Avyakt Vanis to the jurist to make the slogan "judge yourself"

I mean to calm you down to not worry very much about me for whatever I am ready to do, whatever i do and the result that comes out of it for this i will be facing the appointed authority.

[john]

So, by this admission that you are prepared to lie , I have nothing more to say to you.

[andrey]

It means everyone you speak to never lies. Lucky one's both.

The slogan of the demons is, "Let darkness prevail forever". It is the same as to say we can never know the truth.

[fluffy bunny]

I think as a whole this whole process is not done with the real desire for to know a reality, but to dismagify.

At some point the kids have to grow up and discover that Santa Claus does not exist and the fairy stories were not real.

How can it be right or even productive, to lie to promote truth ... especially in a free and open society like the West or even India?

On being caught, what is the right course of action?

For me, what is left once all the illusions are removed is the clean, pure water of truth. What the BKWSU seems to show through its actions is that it is OK to delude others. I do not agree. For the lack of informed critique as provided on this site, those delusions are drowning out the truth. It does not mean that either my opinions or that critique is right but that the testing of the truth is the salt that brings out its flavour.

I do not mean that Shiva is Santa Claus and does not exist. I mean the reality is that the Father goes out to work hard, makes sacrifices to buy the kids the presents and then turns up wearing a costume to suprise them. You be happy as you are andrey sitting on his knee, I want to grow up now and I would like to know answers.