Murli points on Ram

[shivsena]

Dear arjun Bhai.

It has been said in Murlis "Saari mahima Ek ShivBaba ki hai". (meaning: "all the praises are of one ShivBaba")

Now who is this one ShivBaba which Shiva mentions in Murlis many times. Is it bindishivbaba who stays in Paramdham above for more than 4900 years and has no body-conscious for 5000 years and who does not put any effort in Sangamyug... or ...is it the one soul Ram who remains body conscious for almost 4950 years and after reading Murlis and doing purusharth for one birth achieves the 100% nirakari stage like shiv and becomes personified Ramshivbaba. So who is more worship-worthy and praise-worthy !!! Is it bindi ShivBaba or Ramshivbaba ???

Can you please give your views.
shivsena.

[arjun]

Is it bindi ShivBaba or Ramshivbaba ???

It is incorporeal Shiv through the corporeal Ram. Both complement each other. Each one is incomplete without the other.

[shivsena]

It is incorporeal Shiv through the corporeal Ram. Both complement each other. Each one is incomplete without the other.

Dear arjun Bhai.

If ShivBaba ki mahima means the combined mahima of both Shiv+Ram, then please tell me who is this 'Bharat' for whom it is said in Murlis "ShivBaba ki mahima bhi aparm-paar aur Bharat ki mahima bhi apram-paar".

I cannot understand how Ram's mahima be sung both in combined form with Shiva as ShivBaba and alone as Bharat. The equation taught by advance knowledge that Ram=ShivBaba=Sangamyugi Krishna=Sangamyugi Narayan=prajapita=Bharat, is causing a lot of confusion to any soul who has a logical mind.

shivsena.

[mbbhat]

How many Rams are there?
1)According to BKs there are two Rams:- One is Nirakar Ram(Shiva= ShivBaba= point) either in Paramdham or in a body, it is immaterial to them. Their aim is to concentrate on point. Second is the Corporeal Ram of Tretayug who is two kalas (only 14 of the 16) less.

2)According to PBKs the Ram of Tretayug is Prajapita= Virendra Dev Dixit = Sangamyugi Narayan = Next to God and they consider he remains in corporeal world for all the 50000 years(his stay in Paramdham will be just for a second)

3)Brother ShivSena has different views about Ram but considers that Ram as the highest among human souls.
See the Murli point below.

SM 5-1-75(3):- Aisaa Yoga kamaaye jo karmaateet avasthaa ko paa len phir koyi sajaa na khaaye. JAISE RAMCHANDR HAI UNKO BHI SAJAA KHAANI PADI KYONKI NAAPAAS HO GAYAA. ISLIYE UNKO BAAN DIKHAATE HAI. Khsatriy to tum sab ho. Warriors ho na. Tumhaari ladayi hai Ravan se. Koyi manushy se naheen. Naapaas hone kaaran do kalaa kum ho gayi. Kshatriy bhi kahlaayaa aur peeche bhi aayaa. Tretaa ko do kalaa kum swarg kahenge. Purushaarth to karnaa chaahiye Baap ko pooraa follow karne kaa.

= Imbibe such a Yoga that you become karmaateet and do not receive any punishment. Ramchandr also had to receive punishment since he failed. Hence arrow is shown to him. Of course you all are Kshatriyas. You are warriors is it not?. Your fight is with Maya not with any human being. (Since Ramchandr) failed he got two kalas(degrees) less. (He) got the name Kshatriy and also came LATER.

The Murli point says that Ram came later, got punishment and got lesser degree.

According to BKs, corporeal Ram is of no importance, but are very important to PBKs and Shivsena brother. I request the above mentioned souls to express their views about the Murli point. Is this any third Ram for them?

[arjun]

According to PBKs the Ram of Tretayug is Prajapita= Veerendra Dev Dixit = Sangamyugi Narayan = Next to God and they consider he remains in corporeal world for all the 50000 years(his stay in Paramdham will be just for a second)

According to PBKs, Prajapita (Baba Virendra Dev Dixit) is not the Ram of Silver Age, but of the Confluence Age. The Confluence-Aged Lakshmi (head of vijaymala) becomes the Silver-Aged Ram. The incorporeal Ram is Shiv.

The Murli point says that Ram came later, got punishment and got lesser degree.

According to BKs, corporeal Ram is of no importance, but are very important to PBKs and Shivsena Brother. I request the above mentioned souls to express their views about the Murli point. Is this any third Ram for them?

As regards the Murli points which say that Ram failed, it is about the Confluence-Aged Ram. It is believed by the PBKs that although Shiv entered Brahma Baba's partner (Confluence-Aged Ram) to narrate the meaning of the visions caused to Brahma Baba and thus laid the foundation of the Yagya in the beginning. But since Brahma Baba's partner did not have any vision, he did not develop firm faith at that time and left the Yagya after a few years while Dada Lekhraj continued to sustain the Yagya with the title of Brahma Baba. When Brahma Baba's partner takes rebirth and enters the Yagya again, he is given the bows and arrows of knowledge to sustain himself and the Advance Party that is established through him. In memorial of this sequence of events it is said in the Murlis that Ram failed and that Ram is given bows and arrows. Ram did fail in an exam in the beginning of the Yagya, but is it not possible that the same Ram can pass the final exam and gallop ahead of everyone?

[mbbhat]

Dear Arjun Soul,
Please mention how many Rams are there according to PBKs.

The Murli point clearly says that Ram got punishment, lesser degree and came later. Baba is speaking about karmaateet stage. So I think baba is speaking about the final stage of Confluence Age and not about the beginning of Yagya. For me It seems that the Murli ponit is insulting a Ram. You may take different meaning. It is OK.

I would like to know if this Ram(mentioned in Murli) represents soul of Virendra Dixit?

According to my knowledge PBKs say Virendra Dixit will become first Ram of Silver Age. Am I correct?

[arjun]

Please mention how many Rams are there according to PBKs.

I have already answered:
Incorporeal Ram = Shiv;
Confluence-Aged Ram = Prajapita/Shankar (Baba Virendra Dev Dixit); and
Silver-Aged Ram = Confluence-Aged Sita (head of vijaymala)

According to my knowledge PBKs say Veerendra Dixit will become first Ram of Silver Age. Am I correct?

No.

[button slammer]

Dear arjun Bhai.

It has been said in Murlis "Saari mahima Ek ShivBaba ki hai". (meaning: "all the praises are of one ShivBaba")

Now who is this one ShivBaba which Shiva mentions in Murlis many times. Is it bindishivbaba who stays in Paramdham above for more than 4900 years and has no body-conscious for 5000 years and who does not put any effort in Sangamyug... or ...is it the one soul Ram who remains body conscious for almost 4950 years and and becomes personified Ramshivbaba. So who is more worship-worthy and praise-worthy !!! Is it bindi ShivBaba or Ramshivbaba ???

Can you please give your views.
shivsena.

Is it bindishivbaba who stays in Paramdham

ShivBaba means 'the incorporeal in the corporeal'. You cannot say 'bindishivbaba' Only one soul out of all human souls has a name and that name is Shiv. Until Shiv adopts a corporeal form He cannot be known. He gives his own introduction, and requires no introduction from you. In fact your introduction of ShivBaba makes the unlimited Father disappear. By saying bindishvbaba on the one hand you say ShivBaba is here, but at the same time you say he is not here meaning you remove Shiv back to an inert/unrecognisable non-entity in the Soul World. You sound very confused in this matter. It is however nothing new. Just as the BKs failed to recognize the role of ShivBaba ie, they were attracted to the lap of Brahma so too you are totally engrossed in the name and form of a bodily being, that of Ram/Virendra Dev Dixit. Also just as the BKs placed the child in the Fathers position and committed the greatest blunder/atrocity, so too by saying RamShivBaba you yourself have committed an even grosser mistake.
Everything you say in your above quote is mistaken ie

after reading Murlis and doing purusharth for one birth achieves the 100% nirakari stage like Shiv

There is the understanding that effort is a continuous process and takes place over many births especially the 63 births which in turn are based on effort in the Confluence Age.

who is more worship-worthy and praise-worthy !!! Is it bindi ShivBaba or Ramshivbaba ???

NEITHER!!!
Purity alone is praise-worthy and worship-worthy. Effort is not praised.
ShivBaba is everpure benefactor
'bindishivbaba' is just plain ridiculous and is a poor attempt to remove ShivBaba from the central role in self and world transformation.
Ramshivbaba is even worse, it is perhaps the greatest blunder next to omnipresence.
Each aspect is so twisted from the truth so as to be incomprehensible never mind worship-worthy or praise -worthy.
However all that to one side, best wishes (at least you are trying to makes sense of things). :D

[mbbhat]

I have already answered:

Sorry for the error.

Silver-Aged Ram = Confluence-Aged Sita (head of vijaymala)

1)I think this is Vedanti Bhen. I have heard from PBKs that both the souls of Dixit and Vedanti Bhen will be couples for many births). Is this true? For how many births?

2) Will the Sita of Silver Age be Dixit's soul?

3)Some more Murli points are below.

4)SM 5-3-75(3):- Baap kahte hain is gyaan say tumko bahut sukh milega. Isliye achchee reeti padhkar paas ho jaavo. Ram Sita to naapaas huye na. Isliye tretaa may raajy mila. Pahle padhe huye aage bhari dhoyenge. Daas Daasiyaan banenge. Purusharth kar full paas honaa chaahiye.

= Father says, you will get a lot of happiness from this knowledge. So study well and get passed. Ram and Sita failed is it not? Hence (they) got Kingdom in Silver Age. Before (they) will serve those who had studied well. (They) will become servants. (One) should do effort to pass fully.
4a)From the above Murli point it seems that Ram Sita souls would become servants of those who have studied better than them.

4b) Does not this Murli point say NOT TO BECOME/FOLLOW Ram and SITA?'


4c)Are the mentioned Ram and Sita in this Murli point are Virendra Dixit and Vedanti Bhen?


5)SM 8-6-75(3):- Manushy kuch nahin samajhte. Mandiron may jaakar kahte hain achtam keshavam… Arth kuch nahin. Aise hi stuti karte rahte. Achtam keshavam RamNarayanam. Ab Ram kahaan Narayan kahaan. Tum samajhte ho Ram to naapaas huvaa hai. Tab kshatriy banaa. Unhone phir baan aadi de dye hain. Baat yah hai Maya par jeet pane may naapaas ho gayaa. DEVTA BAN NA SAKA. Isliye unko baan de diyaa hai.

= People do not know anything. They go to temples and say, ‘achtam keshavam..’ No meaning. They simply chant áchtam keshavam RamNarayanam. Now, where is Ram and where is Narayan! You know Ram failed hence became kshatriy(second grade). They have then shown arrows to him. The matter is(or Actually), he failed in getting victory over Maya. HE COULD NOT BECOME DEITY. HENCE ARROWS ARE SHOWN.
6)What is the meaning of 'he could not become deity? Who is this Narayan? Who is this Ram? Dixit or Vedanti's soul or something different? What does Baba say here- who is better between Ram and Narayan?
7)Does head of Vijaymala gets punishment at the end?

[arjun]

1)I think this is Vedanti Bhen. I have heard from PBKs that both the souls of Dixit and Vedanti Bhen will be couples for many births). Is this true? For how many births?

Yes. At least the first 21 births during Golden Age and Silver Age.

2) Will the Sita of Silver Age be Dixit's soul?

Yes.

= Father says, you will get a lot of happiness from this knowledge. So study well and get passed. Ram and Sita failed is it not? Hence (they) got Kingdom in Silver Age. Before (they) will serve those who had studied well. (They) will become servants. (One) should do effort to pass fully.
4a)From the above Murli point it seems that Ram Sita souls would become servants of those who have studied better than them.

Parents, who clean the ******* and urine of their children are their firstclass servants. During the Confluence Age, the souls of Conflunence-aged Ram and Sita serve their children i.e. the soul of Golden Aged Krishna and Radha respectively by sheltering their souls in their bodies and after the Copper Age, they give physical birth to them and thus become their firstclass servants.

4b) Does not this Murli point say NOT TO BECOME/FOLLOW Ram and SITA?'

Ram and Sita failed, but only in the beginning of the Yagya. But they make up when they take rebirth and enter the Yagya again. They set an example of highest efforts in the Rudramala and Vijaymala respectively. It is upto you whether you wish to follow those who have already left their bodies or those who are going to get revealed as Confluence-Aged Ram Sita.

4c)Are the mentioned Ram and Sita in this Murli point are Veerendra Dixit and Vedanti Bhen?

Yes.

= People do not know anything. They go to temples and say, ‘achtam keshavam..’ No meaning. They simply chant áchtam keshavam RamNarayanam. Now, where is Ram and where is Narayan! You know Ram failed hence became kshatriy(second grade). They have then shown arrows to him. The matter is(or Actually), he failed in getting victory over Maya. HE COULD NOT BECOME DEITY. HENCE ARROWS ARE SHOWN.
6)What is the meaning of 'he could not become deity? Who is this Narayan? Who is this Ram? Dixit or Vedanti's soul or something different? What does Baba say here- who is better between Ram and Narayan?

All these titles (Ram, Narayan, Krishna) belong to the no.1 human soul, i.e. Prajapita Brahma.

7)Does head of Vijaymala gets punishment at the end?

It is said in the Murlis that except 8 everyone else has to suffer punishments to varying degrees. As far as I know she does not get a place in the top 8 deities and hence she may suffer some punishment, but it may be negligible when compared to others.

[shivsena]

However all that to one side, best wishes (at least you are trying to makes sense of things). :D

Dear brother.

That is exactly what i am trying to do; understand things in the right perspective and give a message to my pbk brothers that many things in advance knowledge do not make sense and are contra-dictory to Sakar Murlis; so please do not accept blindly that advance knowledge is given by ShivBaba, but try to co-relate all the advance teachings with what is said in Sakar Murlis. That is all.

shivsena.

[mbbhat]

mbbhat:- The Murli point says that Ram came later, got punishment and got lesser degree.

Dear Arjun soul,

If the points are not explained fully, something more need to be asked again and again. In the Murli point I had written in my previous posts, it is cleary mentioned that Ram came later and also got punishment and lesser degree.
[For BKs it is very clear. They believe that Ram failed, got punishment and came later in heaven].

According to PBKs,

1)What is punishment here?
2)What is the meaning of later.
3)Significance of lesser degree? Usually degree is given at the end(after final examination). But you say that the Murli point belongs to beginning of Yagya.

I am not forcing you to answer. I just would like the readers know understand how Murli points are interpreted by BKs and PBKs

[mbbhat]

... When Brahma Baba's partner takes rebirth and enters the Yagya again, he is given the bows and arrows of knowledge ...

Dear Arjun soul( or any PBK),
Please see the Murli point once again.

SM 5-1-75(3)= Ramchandr also had to receive punishment since he failed. Hence arrow is shown to him. Of course you all are Kshatriyas. You are warriors is it not?. Your fight is with Maya not with any human being. (Since Ramchandr) failed he got two kalas(degrees) less. (He) got the name Kshatriy and also came LATER.

It is cleary said Ram failed, HENCE arrow is shown to him. So according to Murli point the arrow is a symbol of failure. But how can you say arrow is the symbol knowledge.

Dear Shivsena soul,
Will you please express your views about how many Rams are there and your interpretations about the Murli points I have presented in this thread?

[arjun]

It is cleary said Ram failed, HENCE arrow is shown to him. So according to Murli point the arrow is a symbol of failure. But how can you say arrow is the symbol knowledge.

He failed, but in the beginning of the Yagya and not in the final paper. So, he was given the bows and arrows of knowledge to reach the top position with his own efforts.

[shivsena]

Dear Shivsena soul,
Will you please express your views about how many Rams are there and your interpretations about the Murli points I have presented in this thread?

Dear bhat Bhai.

I do not have any idea why so many Rams have been mentioned in Murlis.
I know of only one Ram(one who attains the 100% incorporeal stage) and who becomes like Shiva in all respects and will be called as "bhagwan, Ishwar, parampita paramatma, ShivBaba etc".
I have no idea of who is Ramchandra and why chandra is associated with Ram, when Ram's soul is actually Gyan-surya.
I do not know who is this Ram who failed in the beginning and i do not have any proof that sevakram was Ram's soul (as believed by PBKs) and i have never read in any Murli about Ram studying RajYoga, so there is no question of Ram passing any exam in future.

shivsena.