False Gita, and its effect

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Re: False Gita, and its effect

Post by mbbhat »

Post No. 73)Essence in Gita - Part One:-

315)Gita 08- 09 [Chapter 08- verse/shloka/sloka 09 ] says/indicates - form of God is POINT (smaller than an atom or molecule).
"kavim puraaNa... "
https://www.bhagavad-Gita.org/Gita/verse-08-09.html
God is Omniscient, the most ancient one, the Controller, subtler than the subtlest, the Support of all, and the possessor of an inconceivable divine form; He is brighter(impressive) than the sun, and beyond all darkness of ignorance.

316) Gita 08-10 indicates place of soul is in the forehead/brain = between the eyebrows (BHRUKUTI). https://www.bhagavad-Gita.org/Gita/verse-08-10.html
"prayaaNa kaalE..."
One who at the time of death, with unmoving mind attained by the practice of Yoga, fixes the prāṇ (life airs) between the eyebrows, and steadily remembers the Divine Lord with great devotion, certainly attains Him

317)Gita 08- 11 says to practice CELIBACY and to control senses.
"yadaksharam..."

Scholars of the Vedas describe Him as Imperishable; great ascetics practice the vow of celibacy and renounce worldly pleasures to enter into Him. I shall now explain to you briefly the path to that goal.

318)Rest few slokas in the chapter direct to meditate/remember God always.

319)Finally, Gita 08- 28 says - if one properly does this effort, he will attain higher merit than what is said in Vedas, yagyas(rituals), donation, etc.
https://www.holy-bhagavad-Gita.org/chapter/8/verse/28
"vEdEshu...."
The yogis, who know this secret, gain merit far beyond the fruits of Vedic rituals, the study of the Vedas, performance of sacrifices, austerities, and charities. Such yogis reach the Supreme Abode.
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Re: False Gita, and its effect

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Post No. 74)Essence in Gita - Part Two:-

320)In chapter 15, Geography, karma, rebirth, spiritual efforts are discussed. Finally we can come to the following conclusion-

a)There are three beings - One is - nature/material/body/perishable. Then souls - above material, hence imperishable (but can be infuenced), third is the highest God who is both imperishable and uninfluenceable, and most powerful, hence the Supreme Soul.

b)God cannot be omnipresent. His power only can be felt. Like sun is not imnipresent, but his energy can be felt anywhere. Like a driver controls the whole car, but not present in each and every atom (piece and part) of the car.

c)God's/Supreme abode is beyond this physical world.

d)Human souls also descend from the Supreme World to play their role, and hence the name INVERTED TREE. They get influenced by the nature and hence get degraded. They even forget that they are different than the body. Hence commit mistakes, get incluenced and degraded.

e)For upliftment, human souls should detach their mind from material things, practice themselves as separate than the body and remember God.


321) World Geography:-

Gita says - Essence of the knowledge lies in understanding the INVERTED TREE. One who inculcates knowledge of the INVERTED TREE.

In detail:-
BG - 15- 01 to 05 .
https://www.holy-bhagavad-Gita.org/chapter/15/verse/1

ūrdhva-mūlam adhaḥ-śhākham aśhvatthaṁ prāhur avyayam
chhandānsi yasya parṇāni yas taṁ veda Silver Age veda-vit

BG 15.1: The Supreme Divine Personality said: They speak of an eternal aśhvatth tree with its roots above and branches below. Its leaves are the Vedic hymns, and one who knows the secret of this tree is the knower of the Vedas.

As we now know that we souls descend from Paramdham to this physical world, the root is above and the tree is below, hence the INVERTED and IMPERISHABLE TREE (CREATION/TIMECYCLE).
So, this is about the time cycle. In other words, the role/play of Souls, Supreme Soul in the eternal world drama stage.

In 15-2, 15-3, 15-4, 15-5 - the slokas say about karma/action, and good, bad karmas, thoughts, etc. How a soul does and karma/actions. It also says how a soul gest binded/bound by actions and nature/body. It aso says- one should get dispassion from the material world to get free from the bondage.

322)Which is Supreme ABODE?
323) Is God really omnipresent?-


BG - 15-06 [BhagavadGita Chapter 15, verse 06]

https://www.holy-bhagavad-Gita.org/chapter/15/verse/6

"na tad bhāsayate sūryo na śhaśhāṅko na pāvakaḥ
yad gatvā na nivartante tad dhāma paramaṁ Mama"

= BG 15.6: Neither the sun nor the moon, nor fire can illumine that Supreme Abode of Mine. Having gone There, one does not return [to this material (Iron Aged*) world] again.

na—neither; tat—that; bhāsayate—illumine; sūryaḥ—the sun; na—nor; śhaśhāṅkaḥ—the moon; na—nor; pāvakaḥ—fire; yat—where; gatvā—having gone; na—never; nivartante—they return; tat—that; dhāma—Abode; paramam—supreme; Mama—Mine

This sloka says God's abode is beyond the material world, hence HE cannot be omnipresent.

*- The sloka says- After going there, there is no return. Here, we fail to accept it as it is. We would like to interpret this as - no return to the Iron Aged world. This part in the sloka is questionable, because when God HIMSELF returns/incarnates from that world(Supreme Abode) to this world to purify , how can any human soul get PERMANENT liberation (MOKSHA)?

325)In case, if MOKSHA really exists, then importance of Establishing DHARMA and importance of God fail. Humans rise above God. Because if moksha is the real goal (leaving the material world), then what is the significance of establishing DHARMA in material world?

Also, if a human soul can get moksha for permanent/eternally, then value of God becomes lower, since God does not get moksha, as HE has to serve the world to establish dharma/righetousness in the world.

326) BG - 15- 08 mentions about rebirth.

shareeram yadvaapnoti yachchaapyutkraamteeshvaraha |
griheetvaitaani samyaati vaayurgandhaanivaashayaat || 8 ||

When the lord acquires a body, and when he leaves it, he takes them and departs, like the wind takes odours from their seats.

shareeram : body
yat : when
avaapnoti : acquires
yat : when
cha : again
api : also
utkraamti : leaves
eeshvaraha : lord/owner
griheetvaitaani : takes them
samyaati : departs
vaayuhu : wind
gandhaan : odours
iva : like
aashayaat : seats

Note that the term "Ishwara" here implies to Lord/Owner of one's own body, not to God HIMSELF.

327) BG 15-09 says how a soul/driver rides/uses the body/vehicle through the senses(clutch, brake, accelerator, steering, etc).

https://www.holy-bhagavad-Gita.org/chapter/15/verse/9

328) The next few slokas also say about - rebirth, efforts to control senses, etc.

329)Verses 15-12, to 15 -15 can create confusion by meaning - God is omnipresent as they say God enters in all the bodies, including nature like Sun, Moon, etc.

https://gitajourney.com/2013/03/17/bhag ... hapter-15/

But, actually, the real significance is - God is Purifier of all the souls (including nature), but NOT present in it. Like a person manufactures/transforms something into a product, or a generator recharges a battery. Similarly, it is God's power that recharges even the Iron Aged World into Golden Aged world.
Creator cannot be omnipresent within the creation. Generator cannot be within the battery or engineer cannot be present inside the walls and floors of a building. A cook cannot be present inside the food.

330)These can be seen in the next slokas.

https://www.holy-bhagavad-Gita.org/chapter/15/verse/16
https://asitis.com/15/16.html

"BG 15.16: There are two kinds of beings in creation, the kṣhar (perishable) and the akṣhar (imperishable). The perishable are all beings in the material realm. The imperishable are the the liberated beings."

"There are two classes of beings, the fallible and the infallible. In the material world every entity is fallible, and in the spiritual world every entity is called infallible."

The former is the body/nature/materials which are perishable (physically their name, form and qualities change ) and the latter is the souls (any soul remains as a soul, its form never changes, but quality only changes as per its karma - from say pyunyaatma to paapaatma, devtaatma, etc) which are imperishable.

BG 15.17: Besides these, is the Supreme Divine Personality, who is the indestructible Supreme Soul. He enters the Three Worlds as the unchanging controller and supports all living beings.

God is even above souls - "Hence his both form and quality remain unchanges, he is known as TRUTH (Never changing/influenced).
"

331) God is separate than nature and also human and animals souls. Hence Supreme.
https://www.holy-bhagavad-Gita.org/chapter/15/verse/18

"yasmāt kṣharam atīto ’ham akṣharād api chottamaḥ
ato ’smi loke vede cha prathitaḥ puruṣhottamaḥ

BG 15.18: I am transcendental to the perishable world of matter, and even to the imperishable soul; hence I am celebrated, both in the Vedas and the Smṛitis, as the Supreme Divine Personality.

15-19, and 15-20 mention more importance of God and direct to worship/love/remember HIM with full of devotion to attain perfection.
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Re: False Gita, and its effects

Post by mbbhat »

Post No. 75)Essence in Gita - Part Three:-
God is Anaadi(has no beginning), Unborn, Supreme, neither corporeal, nor can become corporeal but takes support of corporeal(human body), or takes DIVINE BIRTH(INCARNATION)


333)Sloka 10- 03 (Chapter 10, verse 03)
"yo māmajam anādiṁ cha vetti loka-maheśhvaram
asammūḍhaḥ Silver Age martyeṣhu sarva-pāpaiḥ pramuchyate"

https://www.holy-bhagavad-Gita.org/chapter/10
https://www.holy-bhagavad-Gita.org/chapter/10/verse/3

"Those who know me as unborn and beginningless, and as the Supreme Lord(maheshwar) of the universe, they among mortals are free from illusion and released from all sins/evils."

The above sloka says - God is unborn (means he cannot take birth through a mother's womb like human beings.

334)Also- Note that God of Gita HIMSELF says- He is ISHWAR(maheshwar)(not Srikrishna!).
In Gita, word Ishwar (means Shiv) is much more used than word Krishna. We will give the list of such slokas later.

335) In Sloka/Verse 07-24 God of Gita says - HE is neither corporeal, nor can take corporeal form. So, it almost imples bodily SriKrishna cannot be God of Gita.

"BG 7.24

avyaktaṁ vyaktim āpannaṁ
manyante mām abuddhayaḥ
paraṁ bhāvam ajānanto
mamāvyayam anuttamam

Word for word:

avyaktam — nonmanifested; vyaktim — personality; āpannam — achieved; manyante — think; mām — Me;abuddhayaḥ — less intelligent persons; param — supreme; bhāvam — existence; ajānantaḥ — without knowing;Mama — My; avyayam — imperishable; anuttamam — the finest.

Translation:

Unintelligent men, who do not know Me perfectly, think that I, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, Kṛṣṇa, was impersonal before and have now assumed this personality. Due to their small knowledge, they do not know My higher nature, which is imperishable and supreme."

https://bhagavadgitaclass.com/bhagavad- ... 7-text-24/
https://www.gitadaily.com/Gita-07-24-explained/

Note that there is no word Krsna/Krishna in the sloka/verse. (I could/did not find. In case if anyone finds, correct me) It has been added by the authors. Since all the lowkik Gurus consider God of Gita to be deity/bodily Srikrishna, they add word Krishna at many places even when the sloka says - God of Gita is incorporeal.

336)Now/But- Sloka 09-11 says God takes (support of) human body.

https://prabhupadabooks.com/bg/9/11?d=1

"TEXT 11
avajānanti māṁ mūḍhā
mānuṣīṁ tanum āśritam
paraṁ bhāvam ajānanto
Mama bhūta-maheśvaram
SYNONYMS
avajānanti—deride; mām—Me; mūḍhāḥ—foolish men; mānuṣīm—in a human form; tanum—body; āśritam—assuming; param—transcendental; bhāvam—nature; ajānantaḥ—not knowing; Mama—Mine; bhūta—everything that be; maheśvaram—supreme proprietor.
can not find image file: books/Bhagavad-Gita-As-It-Is/plate28.jpg

"Fools deride Me when I descend in human form."

TRANSLATION
Fools deride Me when I descend/assume(take support) in the human form. They do not know My transcendental nature and My supreme dominion over all that be. "

337)Now/Here the confusion arises. In the former sloka, God says- he does not become personal/corporeal. In the next, he says- he takes corporeal form.

The small difference/discrimination to be understood is God never takes physical birth through a mother, hence HE does not have body of his own (like SriKrishna or any other).
But, he DIRECTLY enters body of a matured person. Without understanding the difference between "entrance to body/brain/bhrukuti (parakaaya pravesha = entrance to some other person's body)" and the physical birth(entrance to womb), it might have made devotees to believe number one deity SriKrishna himself to be God of Gita.

338)Kindly note that even in this sloka, the word/name for God of Gita is "Ishwar/maheshwar/maheshwaram", not Krishna.

339)A note:- Exact translation of word "ASRITAM" pronounced as AASHRITHAM" in the last sloka (9-11) - I am not sure- whether it is ASSUME or TAKE SUPPORT/SHELTER.

But, most probably, "aashraya" means "shelter". So, most probably, "aashritam" means to take shelter/support, which indicates entrance to a body, not physical birth like others. My knowledge in sanscrit is low, hence at present, do not have much information. But, from the first sloka, it clearly says- God cannot get converted into corporeal form or any corporeal form is not part of God, (hence cannot be primary, can be only secondary. Hence God is higher than physical body/appearance of deity SriKrishna).

340)In some Gita books (or websites), the translation is not perfect. (Even if they put the title- "Bhagavadgita AS IT IS"). But, it does not affect much since the Gita itself is FALSE Gita.

341)Sloka 04-06 and 04-09 says God's birth is DIVINE.

https://www.gitadaily.com/Gita-04-06-explained/
"BG 4.6
ajo ’pi sann avyayātmā
bhūtānām īśvaro ’pi san
prakṛtiṁ svām adhiṣṭhāya
sambhavāmy ātma-māyayā

Word for word:
ajaḥ — unborn; api — although; san — being so; avyaya — without deterioration; ātmā — body; bhūtānām — of all those who are born; īśvaraḥ — the Supreme Lord; api — although; san — being so; prakṛtim — in the transcendental form; svām — of Myself; adhiṣṭhāya — being so situated; sambhavāmi — I do incarnate; ātma–māyayā — by My internal energy.

Translation:
"Although I am unborn and My transcendental body never deteriorates, and although I am the Lord of all living entities, I still appear in every millennium in My original transcendental form."

[Note:- Mostly, the words - "in every millennium" is not present in THIS sloka(of course it appears in previous sloka), but added by the author.
Also- the words "My Internal energy" has been ignored/missing in the translation. If I am wrong, kindly correct me.]

In another translation
https://bhagavad-Gita.org/Gita/verse-04-06.html
"Although being birthless, imperishable and immutable, Lord/Ishwar of all living entities, being so- situated I appear in this word in My orginal transcendental form by my internal potency."

342)Anyhow, this sloka says- God comes but in his original form. Means HIS FORM is NOT changed by INCARNATION.

343)Sloka 04 - 09 says - Birth and Activities of God is DIVINE.

https://bhagavad-Gita.org/Gita/verse-04-09.html
"O Arjuna, one who knows transcendental reality of birth and activities ..."
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Re: False Gita, and its effects

Post by mbbhat »

Post No. 76)Meaning of AVTAAR/INCARNATION got confused even more:-

344) https://www.gitadaily.com/krishnas-avat ... carnation/

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gbBnmbeAFWE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rt-T0leuV0U
The English word “incarnation” is derived primarily from Abrahamic theology – it describes Jesus who, Christianity holds, is God descended in flesh as a human being.

As this word is common in mainstream religious diction and discourse, many Bhakti teachers often use it for introducing contemporary audiences to the concept of avatara. However, the word incarnation has a denotation that contradicts an essential Bhakti understanding of the nature of avatara. “Incarnation” literally means “to come in flesh”; the root “carna” is seen in words such as carnivorous animals (flesh-eating animals) and carnal desires (desires to enjoy the flesh). However, when Krishna descends to this world, he doesn’t descend in a form of flesh(?!); he appears in his transcendental form. The Bhagavad-Gita (04.06) declares that he remains the imperishable Lord of all living beings, even when he descends here. This declaration implies that he doesn’t come under the control of material nature, which sentences all embodied beings through time’s inexorable flow to bodily deterioration and destruction.

Given Krishna’s transcendence, his avatar may be better described as a descent. He exists eternally in the spiritual world and manifests in this world during the period when he reveals his lila here. Pertinently, the word avatara literally means one who comes down or descends.

Bhakti teachers avoid burdening us with a double unfamiliarity: both an unfamiliar term and an unfamiliar concept. Terms are verbal handles for mental concepts. By first giving us a familiar handle to grasp an unfamiliar concept and then explaining the concept’s unfamiliar dimensions, they help us move towards comprehension, one step at a time. Such comprehension culminates in spiritual devotion when we understand how charming and loving Krishna is: charming in manifesting eternally as an accessible, attractive Supreme Person; and loving in revealing that manifestation in this world for attracting and delivering us.
345)Without understanding incorporeal Supreme Soul ShivBaba, people have considered flesh or physical birth through womb as incarnation.
They believe SriKrishna took birth after 9 months pregnancy, took physical sustenance, is it not. [But, still there is a concept of VishwaRoopa (which we will discuss later), hence there is some knowledge/feeling beyond physical body as well.]

346)But, in case of Jesus, the level goes still lower, as they consider blood of Jesus is the main cause in purification of soul.

Post No. 77) Corporeal/Deity got seated above Incorporeal/God or CREATION got placed above the CREATOR:-
Post No. 78) Relation between Krishna and Vishnu got deteriorated:-
Post No. 79) Value of TRIMURTIS also got deteriorated:-

347)Normal belief(especially in incarnation) in Hinduism is- Vishnu is the main/primary personality who sustains the world by taking different avtaars/incarnations, and out of his TEN main avtaars, avtaar of Krishna(eighth) is only one of them.

But, now some Krishna believers say- Krishna is superior/main to Vishnu.

http://www.Krishna.com/Krishna-and-vish ... %20candle.
Although Vishnu is equal to Krishna, Krishna is the original source. Vishnu is a part, but Krishna is the whole. This is the version given by Vedic literatures. In Brahma-samhita the example is given of an original candle which lights a second candle. Although both candles are of equal power, one is accepted as the original, and the other is said to be kindled from the original. The Vishnu expansion is like the second candle. He is as powerful as Krishna, but the original Vishnu is Krishna. Brahma and Lord Shiva are obedient servants(!) of the Supreme Lord, and the Supreme Lord as Vishnu is an expansion of Krishna."
348)The above link says- Krishna is original/full, and Vishnu is only a next/part! More confusion for normal Hindu devotees (as it goes against the normal belief said in 347).
Also - place of real God = Incorporeal Shiv got placed in the bottom/ordinary only.

349)Actually, (we now know) Krishna is creation of Shiv. But, according to few Krishna followers, both Brahma and Shiv (and also Vishnu) are creation(obedient servants) of Krishna!
https://vedabase.io/en/library/tlc/8/...(in the tenth para) ... . Similarly, Lord Śiva is an expansion of Kṛṣṇa, but he cannot act like Kṛṣṇa, nor can we derive the spiritual restoration from Lord Śiva that we derive from Kṛṣṇa. The essential difference is that Lord Śiva has a connection with material nature(!) but Viṣṇu, or Lord Kṛṣṇa, has nothing to do with material nature(!). In Śrīmad-Bhāgavatam (10.88.3) it is stated that Lord Śiva is a combination of three kinds of transformed consciousness known as vaikārika, taijasa and tāmasa.
350)See the extent to which some Krishna devotees defame Highest of High Shiv. They say- Shiv has connection with material, but Krishna does not ! (which is exactly opposite to the truth. Actually, Shiv is the creator, and Krishna is the highest/best creation.)
That is why/what ShivBaba says- "I am defamed most".

351)Now- even if the above Krishna believers say/claim- "Krishna has nothing to do with material nature, (but if they give/show him human/deity form),- WHO ALL will accept it and HOW will it fit?"

352)Hence - other religions also failed to give respect to Hinduism, since most of them believe in incorporeal God, and/but false Gita has made the situation upside down. And- Krishna/corporeal got seated above the incorporeal/ShivBaba.

353)Now, we all know that Vishnu = Krishna (in couple form after coronation). But, when Krishna is displaced from his normal seat and placed higher, the relationship between Krishna and Vishnu also got spoiled.
Also- Trimurtis - Brahma, Vishnu and Shankar - who are very next to Shiv/God - the Trimurti seats also got lost(degraded or shifted to lower place) their importance.
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Re: False Gita, and its effects

Post by mbbhat »

Post No. 80)Essence in Gita - Part FOUR:-
Human/Deity Form Sri Krishna loses the place of God of Gita:-


355)From previous posts - regarding sloka 04-06, 04-09 and 7-24, logically, we can say-

a)God of Gita is incorporeal,
b)REAL/HIGHEST INCARNATION is direct entrance to forehead/brain of one's body/Chariot (not a mother's womb). Then only HIS form will NOT change. (more is explained below).

c)God's birth and actions are DIVINE. Hence God will NOT ride/use(stay in) the Chariot/instrument/body whole day.
[If God remains in the Chariot whole day, eats food full stomach, drinks, sleeps, goes to toilet, etc, etc, on a daily manner, the activities cannot be said 100% DIVINE. Because that is human.]

So- the Incorporeal God is free to enter the HUMAN body/Chariot at any time when he needs to deliver knowledge to do the auspicious actions -like giving drushti, vision, etc.
In other words, the incorporeal God takes shelter of the Chariot only for the auspicious work (to give unlimited knowledge or knowledge of time cycle and teach RajYoga).

Hence God is not controlled by the nature/body, but uses the body/nature. He can enter and leave the body like a driver enters and leaves a car. But, we human souls remain in the body throughout the period from birth to death. Hence God's CONTROLLING and RULING (=HANDLING/DRIVING) power is the HIGHEST, and fully DIVINE.]

Then only these slokas will fit properly.

d)So- that human body/Chariot CANNOT be that of God. Means God cannot be the OWNER(MAIN USER) of THAT body, (and does not stay in the body throughout the day). Then only we can say- God's form never changes.
[But, Sri Krishna does not fit here. Can anyone say- the body that has come out of Devaki's womb does not belong to Sri Krishna? Isf so- whose body it is? Who else uses that body of deity form Sri Krishna?

Also- Is not that body which has come out from Devaki's womb is made(or at least has contents) of flesh?

Hence no one can deny SriKrishna is the owner(main user) of the body. Hence it violates the sloka - 07-24.

e)Surprisingly, note that - the sloka(7-24) says- "Unintelligent men, who do not know Me perfectly, think that I, the Supreme Personality of Godhead, was impersonal before and have now assumed this personality. ..." (Does it means the unintelligent people believe God takes at least ten corporeal forms/avtaars like fish, tortoise, pig, ...Sri Ram, Sri Krishna, ..etc.- Readers may judge for themselves).

f)So, the last/right option is- the incorporeal God can take the Chariot(corporeal body) like for LOAN/RENT. Then only these slokas can fit.
[This is what most beloved Ocean of knowledge ShivBaba usually says us in Murlis].

356)Just see - how easily the "incorporeal Shiv, divine point of light and might" perfectly fits to the above slokas.
[That is why sometimes in Murlis, ShivBaba says- "just name has got changed in Gita" (from incorporeal Shiv to Sri Krishna). Means many of the slokas fit to incorporeal properly, and the teachings as well. More on this will be explained later.]
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Re: False Gita, and its effects

Post by mbbhat »

Post No. 81)Essence in Gita - Part FIVE:-

a)Neither the Deities, nor great sages can know God's birth/incarnation/origin-

b)Dasha_Avataar (Ten incarnations) or just ONE AVTAAR?-


357) Gita sloka 10-02 says -
http://www.pradipbobhate.com/article/sh ... #gsc.tab=0

https://thegita.net/thegita-chapter-10-shloka-02/
https://bhagavad-Gita.org/Gita/verse-10-02.html

"Even the Deities and the greatest of wiseman do not know the secret of my birth in this world (in human form). You should understand,my dear friend, that it is from ME that all of these Deities and wisemen originate."

"Neither the hosts of demigods nor the great sages know My origin, for, in every respect, I am the source of the demigods and the sages".
358)So- when (as per Gita) - even the highest personalities (deities and sages) CANNOT KNOW God's incarnation, how can anyone else know (by his own effort) about God?
So- It implies until and unless God HIMSELF incarnates and gives his introduction, none can know about HIM.

359)So- this indicates- in earlier yugas/ages (whether Golden, Silver Ages, etc) no one can know about God.
[Because Gita episode is shown as end of Copper Age].
Now- this now questions about the famous Ten avtaars/incarnations.
Hence this sloka adds weightage to the sloka number 7-24 which imply- previous avtaars are of no much value, and THIS ALONE has the HIGHEST value. There cannot be anything more special in future, as these slokas imply the prsent avtaar as- SUPREMACY.

360)The sloka says- No deity or saint can know about God's incarnation. But, in the epic Mahabharatha or TV serials of Mahabharat episode/s, it is shown as- many/some deities and saints knew(or got visions) about coming/birth of SriKrishna and felt him as God/Supreme.
This shows that the epic writers or the TV serial producers have/had not understood Gita.

361)This sloka also indicates that the possibility of getting knowledge of Gita through a saint or deity is minimum/less, is it not.
-------------- ----------
362)Great essence of Yoga(spiritual union/effort) are also wonderful in the above chapter.
Sloka 10-07 https://bhagavad-Gita.org/Gita/verse-10-06.html
https://thegita.net/chapter-10/
"He who fully understands my Supreme Glories and the divine powers of Yoga, will undoubtedly achieve the most Supreme goal of a lifetime, and that is, to become united and enjoined with ME. To achieve this Supreme state one must take part in firm and constant meditation, having only Myself fixed in his mind at all times."
Great, wonderful.

Similarly the slokas 9, 10 and 11 in the same chapter also motivate a yogi(effort_maker) to merge in Supreme/Spiritual Power, Peace, Love and Bliss.
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Re: False Gita, and its effects

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Post No. 82)Importance of RELIGIOUS SCRIPTURES-

363)The main four authorities/values in the world are-

--- DHARM Satta (Religious Power), - Ones' RELIGION , Religious Leaders, etc.
---RAAJY Satta (Political Power)- related to CITIZENSHIP, Constitution,, Laws, Legal documents, etc.
---DHAN Satta (Wealth Power or Physical Wealth and Resources), which begins from = Roti, Kapdaaa, Makaan = Food, cloth and shelter leading to highest standards of Life and culture),
---VIGYAAN ki Satta (Power of Science/Technology).

364)These four can be summarized into two- Religious Power and Political Power.
--Because these two powers will be RULING practically. Other two powers are only nimitt (instruments). They come under these two.

365)Technology and Physical Wealth can be transferred, sold, purchased easily, that too SEVERAL TIMES.

---But, changing/transfering Political and Religious attributes are not so easy.
For example, for most of people, CITIZENSHIP or RELIGION will be same from birth to death.
---Also- Changing Religion, changing citizenship, acquring/losing political power/seat, changing laws, - these influence not only the partcular person, but also his relatives, society, and country, and even the international community.


---And- One cannot(will not) change religion and citizenship them "now and then" like physical properties and technologies. So- it is clear that these two powers are DEEPLY ROOTED.

366)Many Kingdoms/civilizations came and left. Their laws now have become obsolete. Any Kingdom or a political power would have been in power for a maximum of around couple of centuries. Democracy, Constitutions, laws, etc. also have influence within couple of centuries only.
---Any other documents, related to property, agreement, acedamic qualifications, etc. - have influence on fewer number of people and for even smaller period.

But, Gita, Vedas had/have influence for more than 2000 years. Similarly, Bible, Quran, etc.- had/have influence on society from their beginning till today.
------ ----
Actually,
Post No. 83)Highest Intoxications/Attainments- ALAF, BEY, CHARACTER, KNOWLEDGE & SERVICE:-

367)Actually, the highest attainments are ALAF(God Father) and BEY(Property= Heaven, liberation).
But- note that all the scriptures speak about these only.

--God is invisible. Even HIS PROPERTY= heaven and liberation are not in front of anyone now. So the tool to understand, discuss these highest attainements is only SPIRITUAL KNOWLEDGE(Murlis = True Gita).
--We all BKs, give highest importance to Murlis [after Yaad/Yoga/remembrance( of ALAF and BEY)].
In this forum also, most of the members use Murli POINTs (TRUE/HIGHEST Gita/SCRIPTURE) for discussions.

--But, for worldly people, this tool is their individual scriptures only/mainly. They do not know value of ShivBaba's Murlis.
--Hence teaching/correcting and understanding scriptures is another way to understand spirituality.

368)First step of maturity in spiritual life is

----Authority/intoxication/feeling/experince of ALAF and BEY.
---Next step is intoxication/authority of/over DHARNA/CHARACTER
---Next is intoxication of KNOWLEDGE.
--- Next is intoxication is of SERVICE.

---Intoxication/authority of/over SCRIPTURES is unique as well as part of the last two.

Most importantly, Baba has said- Service will become complete when Gita is corrected/understood.

Command over a scriptures also bring a unique maturity. Like when we underdstand significance of Bhaktimarg festivals, rituals, etc, we get an eternal intoxication/happiness/success.
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Re: False Gita, and its effects

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Post No. 84)Highest tools of Life: SPIRITUAL KNOWLEDGE and RELIGIOUS SCRIPTURES:-

369) Posts No. 82 & 83 are explianed in more detail here.

Baba says- half a Kalpa(time cycle) is Gyaan/Knowledge, the other half Kalpa is Bhakti/worship.
---In the first half, it is influence/effect/result of KNOWLEDGE.
---In the second half, it is influence of path of Bhakti/worship hence, - SCRIPTURES.

---Bhakti or scriptures are like yaadgaars(memorials) of knowledge too.
So- in whole of Kalpa, knowledge of spirituality and knowledge of Bhakti will be the most influencing.

370)It is said- RELIGION is MIGHT. Spirituality is the Highest religion.
---Hence in the first Kalpa, the highest/true religion (saddharm) will be ruling.
---In the second half, the rest of the religions will be ruling/infuencing the world.

371)God adopts Gita:- Like God adopts Iron Aged World and children and transforms them to heaven and deities, similarly, HE adopts/corrects lowkik Gita too. Post 11 here - viewtopic.php?f=40&t=2422&p=42360&hilit ... 40b#p42360

372)For lowkik people, their individual scriptures the tools. They all have intoxication of their scriptures. When Gita is corrected, or true Gita is revealed, then only other religion people will be able to realize that their scriptures too are false and has no capacity to take them to heaven.
Because most beloved Ocean of Knowledge incorporeal Supreme Soul ShivBaba says- " Gita hain Maap Baap. Baaki sab baal bachche hain. Gita knadan honey se baaki sab shaastr khandan hotey hain = All other scriptures are kids to Gita. And, when Gita becomes false, all the rest of scriptures become false".

373)Speciality of Gita
---Gita is Father and mother of all the scriptures. (Explained in Post No. 71 -viewtopic.php?f=39&t=2717&p=55416&hilit ... 40b#p55416 ).
---Gita (verse 4- 38) says- there is nothing as great as knowledge (na hi jnaanena sadrusham) - here -
https://www.holy-bhagavad-Gita.org/chapter/4/verse/38
Baba also says- I love "gyaani tu atmas (knowledgeful souls)".

It is only in Gita and Murlis, both gyaan/knowledge and Yoga/remembrance/meditation are praised and explained.

374)Even though Gita is mother and Father of all the scriptures, today other religions are ruling the world. They have higher intoxication (plus false ego too) than Hindus. Many other religious people criticize not only Gita but also Hindu scriptures.

---To a great extent, it is due to name of corporeal Krishna shown as God of Gita, other religious people failed to give respect to Gita.
---Bhakti scriptures have both good and bad, right and wrong/mistakes.
---But- eventhough bad/poor teachings and mistakes/errors are comparitively more in other religious scriptures than Gita (details will be put later), Gita is more criticized, the main reason being Sermonizer of Gita is shown as corporeal Krishna, where as for other religions, it is believed that they are directions of incorporeal God.
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Re: False Gita, and its effects

Post by mbbhat »

Post No. 85)Religion is Might:-

375)It is said "Religion is Might". Has anywhere it is said- "Kingdom is Might?"
Kingdoms come and go. But, religions once come, do not go easily. They usually sustain in the world. This is its unique power/feature.

376)ShivBaba also says- " Main tumhen Ved, shaastron ke saar bataataa hun. " = I teach you essence of Vedas and scriptures.

We(BKs) now, know that most of the wars shown in Hindu scriptures (eg- between deities and demons) are actually internal war between good and evil thoughts within oneself. Heaven was a place free from all vices, but full of character. Then only religion will have value.
Else - if we believe- during period of Krishna, Kans too had been there. During period of Ram, there had been Ravan. Even demons used to conquer heaven. In heaven, there had been alcohol, lust, etc- what value will be there for religion?
If during period of Ram, there had been Ravan, his wife has stolen/kidnapped by Ravan, then Ram sent his wife forest, he fought with his own children later, etc, etc, what would be the praise of Ram Raajy (Kingdom of Ram)?

377)Hence - God comes and corrects (separates milk/truth from water/lies in) the scriptures. And- the most significant part in this is that of Gita.
We now know- the highest/same Deity religion after Copper Age gets called as Hindu religion. [Original Full name is - Adi Sanaatan Devi Devtaa Dharm, shortly DEITY religion]
So- pure stage(initial 50% = heavenly period on earth= Golden and Silver Ages) of sanaatan religion is deitism, and the degraded/later part (in Copper and iron Ages = hell on earth) is Hinduism.

378)At the higher level, "Religion is Might"- fits only for deity religion. Because only DEITY religion rules entire world, that too for at least 50% duration of the time cycle(Kalpa) which is the practical heaven. That is- when deity religion rules, no other religion exists.
Also- Deity religion was "naturally/spiritually(non-violently)" might. It does not fight over other religions to get power. It gets power from God as birthright through adoption of NON-VIOLENCE through True Gita scripture/spiritual knowledge.

At lower level, every(at least major) religion is also might. Every religion plays unique role in the world from its establishment till date.
Lower level means
- they cannot rule entire world. That is- when they rule, other religions too would be existing in the world.
- they accumulate power by violence (by physical wars on non-believers, forceful conversions, etc) too.
[Ahimsaa paramodharmaha = NonViolence is the highest religion. So, violence is definitely against religion, is it not?]
---They get divided into different sects among themselves - eg Catholics & Protestants, Sunni & Shia, etc. and fight among themselves too.
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Re: False Gita, and its effects

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Post No. 86)Word/Title HOLY got deteriorated, misunderstood, less understood and/or hijacked:-

380) As already said- in Post 59 viewtopic.php?f=39&t=2717&p=55345&hilit ... b25#p55345, the title AHIMSA/NON-VIOLENCE got shifted from Hinduism to Buddhism (and Jainism).

Actually, the title "Non - Violence" fits better/best to Hinduism than Buddhism or any other religion.
But, since in Gita and other Hindu scriptures, physical war is shown (thought to be) as the main role in establishing dharma, Hinduism and its scriptures lost grip on non-violence.

[381)But, now, we know that the physical war shown in the scriptures has nothing to do with God and effort-makers.
The real significance of war shown in Hindu scriptures are-
a) "internal war between good and bad (not between deities and asuras)", and
b)the external/physical war between/among body-conscious/ignorant- eg First World war, Second World war, etc.
The weapons shown in Mahabharat scriptures like Brahmaastra, Paashupataastra, etc - are nothing but todays nuclear bombs. ...]


382). Due to Gita became false (due to Gita being thought as motivation for physical war), Gita's grip over title HOLY too reduced to a great extent.

Today, other religions use the world HOLY more than they deserve. Eg- Holy Bible, Holy Quran, etc.
In fact, percentage of holiness in other religious scriptures is very much less. All these scriptures permit violence on animals.
Mostly, according to Quran and Bible (anyone correct me if I am wrong), any non-believer, however good human beings they had been in their life, God Himself will send them to eternal hell for both physical and mental suffering.
In Quran, killing non-believers (however good human beings they may be) is also mostly permitted and suggested.

383)In Gita, lots of verses preach/suggest to inculcate holiness/divinity (sacrifice and become free from vices). But, no such stress is given in verses of other religious scriptures.

But, other religious people utter the word "HOLY" now and then when they utter their religious scripture names Quran, Bible, etc. But, mostly, Gita believers, do not utter word HOLY when they utter Gita.

So, I think, when Gita became false, the word HOLY too lost its significance, is it not? Such a great degradation of world took place.

384)Today, some use the title HOLY to Roman Empire too! - An empire that runs on physical power or weapons gets/hijacked title HOLY! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Holy_Roman_Empire

385)Gita does not claim title'/word HOLY for itself. Because Gita is holy by its nature itself. Lots of verses speak about sacrificing vices in Gita. [Eg- Post No. 71 - http://bk-pbk.info/viewtopic.php?f=39& ... b25#p55416 Gita need not claim for its holiness.
But, other religious scriptures do not have holiness by nature itself. Their verses/teachings do not speak so. So- to propagate their scriptures as holy, they need to use the title HOLY.
And, ridiculous thing is- Even though such religions claim title HOLY to their scriptures, they have conflicts and wars between them.
For example, Christian and Islam dominated countries have become cause for world wars. They even fight physically among their own sects too. So, even practically, I think we cannot see any holiness in their countries.

386)This is another reason for having no concept of RELIGIOUS CONVERSION in Hinduism. Because HOLINESS is more related to FOLLOWING than BELIEVING. But, in other religions, BELIEF is given more important than FOLLOWING.
Even forcible conversions are accepted/permitted/done by these religions.

So- logically, word HOLY does not fit to such religious scriptures. But, still they use extensively.
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Re: False Gita, and its effects

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Post No. 87)Slowly, in Iron Age, All become/became Spiritual or Religious Prostitutes, ATHEISTs, and ORPHANs:-

387)Initially, there had been Concept of One incorporeal God in Hinduism/India. It is the beginning of Bhakti (Path of worship) That is the Satopradhaan/Pure Bhakti, which had started around in the beginning of Dwapur/Copper Age.
Logical proof:- Oldest temples in Bharath/India are Shiva temples in the form of Jyotir_Ling. Hindu scriptures also say about Incorporeal God- even Gita.

388)But, when name of deity Sri Krishna was inserted in the seat of Incorporeal Supreme Soul Shiva, it is like spiritual prostitution. Because incorporeal Shiva is the spiritual groom. Sri Krishna is not Spiritual Bride Groom. Sri Soul of SriKrishna himself/itself is one of the spiritual brides.

389)Today, if we see anywhere in ANY FIELD, it is like prostitution (weak or false relation).
The Abrahamic Religions even though believe and claim One and the same incorporeal God, they failed to connect their mind with the God, and are fighting not only with each other but also among themselves in their own sects. They all have been divided into many sects in their own religion, and have been cause for World wars.
result is- Musilms connectivity/attachment could reach only up to the level of Muhammad, Christians only up to Christ, not the incorporeal God.

If we see Buddishm, there is no concept of God. So- it is as if they have no spiritual Groom at all. Their level is only up to Buddha, who is also only a human personality.

Let it be deity Sri Krishna, or Ibrahim, Buddha, Christ, Muhammad, anyone is just only a spiritual bride of Spiritual Father of all souls- the incorporeal Shiva = Allah = Jehova, etc.

So- all lost connectivity to the real God.

390)Just imagine- If in Gita, name of incorporeal Shiva had been there and the war had been said as spiritual war (internal war with oneself , vices), other religions would have at least noted these things in Hinduism and would have corrected themselves at least to some extent, is it not?

391)In fact, other religions fell outside the track. They lost connectivity even to heaven.
Islam and Christianity who are more conscious of heaven than others, they failed to pay respect to heavenly people (the real deities). According to them, idol worship of any form is a sin!
They even destroyed Shiva(memory of their own incorporeal God) and other deity temples (memory of heaven).
So- they became fully atheists.

392)In Islam and Christianity, there is an insulting word - Kafir/Kuffr or Infidel to the non-believers.
But- in fact, both their belief and acts prove they are more infidels than others. Because they do not know how to respect God/ALAF/Father or deities/heaven/BEY/PROPERTY.

So- when Hindus fail, others too fail. When Gita fails, all other scriptures fail.
[Murli Point - "Gita hai Mayi Baap. Baaki sab baal bachche hain. Gita khandan honey se baaki sab shaastr khandith huye hain = Gita is mother and Father. All the other scriptures are kids and children. When Gita became false, all the other scriptures became false". ]
We can see practically. These religion dominated countries do not either citizenship or visa unconditionally/easily to their own religious followers.
Gulf/Middle east countries consider Asian Muslims as lower level.
America, Russia, Europe- lots of conflicts even though majority of them are Christian dominated countries.
Buddhist dominated countries- China, Japan, Cambodia, Vietnam, etc- lots of genocides, wars on their own people. To what extent do they follow Non- Violence of Buddha?

393) So- I think- It may not be wrong to say- the FIRST STEP in the prostitution is to consider Number One Deity Sri Krishna as God Himself.

394)Summarizing, or adding few points-
As time passes, in Iron Age, no one stands on his/their own foot.

For example- Islam and Christianity who believe in the same incorporeal God had committed Slavery for centuries, and one another too.
Even though British people ruled India for nearly two centuries, they needed support of (had to recruit) Indian and Nepali soldiers too in their army.
Even today, America and few western countries hire/need intelligent, skilled people from other countries to work in their countries.
Islamic Countries may have oil wealth. But, many of them are dependent on companies, employees (even military) of other countries to maintain their country.

395)And- most interestingly- the so-called developed countries cannot sit quiet being satisfied. For example-few western countries have proved that they wish to interfere in region and politics of other countries. Eg- Western countries in destabilizing Vietnam, Iraq, Libya, Syria, Afghanistan, etc.

396)No doubt - Today even Indians have become like prostitutes- many people wish to settle in western countries than their own home country/India.
Even the Indian Govt expects foreign Countries to invest in India.

397)Some praise about Western Culture, Values, Human Rights, etc. But- till dollar or pound grow to high value, where had been their culture? History of their colonial rule and atrocities on the native people- Can they get excuse for these?
[They had committed severe crimes. But- if the concept of Incorporeal God had remained strong, other religions would not have developed high interest in religious conversion or committing atrocities on non-believers.
Also- Hinduism would not have got divided themselves to such an extent as of today. ]
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Re: False Gita, and its effects

Post by jaycdp »

You are right
Ahimsa paramo dharma
Om Shanti
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Re: False Gita, and its effects

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# Post no. 88) Continuation:-

398)As time passed, the abnormal gap developed between upper and lower varna/caste people in Hinduism in Iron Age.
Some Dalit leaders tried to establish an unnatural relation of - "DALIT (lower varna) - Muslim Unity", [even though a)by default one of the core Islamic beliefs is that nonbelievers/KAFIRS would be sent to eternal hell, as well as b)the topmost Dalit leader Dr. Ambedkar had expressed his views on this relation that such a relation is impossibility or very low probability] but failed.

For example - Jogendranath Mandal - a famous Dalit leader who dreamt Dalit- Muslim Unity, migrated to Pakistan and became a minister there (during Partition of Bharath/India in 1947) , but could not stay there for long time, hence soon returned to Mother India in 1950.

https://www.opindia.com/2021/10/dr-br-a ... -Buddhism/

https://theprint.in/theprint-profile/jo ... er/184687/

399)For example, when other religions try to convert Hindus, they usually preach/say - "There are no casteism in their religion", but they themselves are divided into many sects even there. Anyone can find using google search.

400)For vote bank, political leaders are ready to establish relations religiously or with any other political parties too. Some of them even frequently change their parties now and then too.

So- it may not be wrong to say that the Spiritual/First prostitution also had a great impact on the other prostitutions (unnatural, weak, temporary relations) like - Religious, Social, Political prostitutions, etc.

401)But- in UNLIMITED Sense, all are spiritual brothers and sisters, let anyone be in a any country, religion, etc.
The above discussion is done only to explain how much weak, wandering happened/happens in this Iron Aged world, and impact of spiritual degradation on other degradations in the world/society.

402) Actually, the upper and lower caste/varna should be somewhat similar to husband-wife relation. This exists fully in heaven.
[Murli points:-
a)"Vahaan Daas daasi bhi mahal ke andar rahenge, jo raja raani khaayenge, vahee dass, daasi bhi khaayenge = There (in heaven) the servants would also be in the same building of the owners, what owners/Kings eat, even the servants will eat the same food.

b)Vahaan toh daas daasi bhi dil par chadhee huyi hongee = There (In heaven), even the servants would have place in the heart (of the owners).]


403) So- as per drama, heaven would be like Utopia, and as time passes from Copper Age onwards, relations gradually become weaker and weaker.
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