When was this forum actually started? (Sanjeev's story)

[sachkhand]

AUM Shanti.

I have a question which is surpising. I do not know whether others have noticed it or not. While I was reading about the members of this group I saw that admin who is the site administrator of this forum has joined this forum on 01 Jan 1970.

May I know from someone that "When was this forum actually started?" What is their actual agenda? And whether PBKs are running this forum. I hope I will get correct answers.

Thanks.
Sanjeev.

[arjun]

Dear sanjeev Bhai,

Om Shanti. As far as I remember this forum was started in the first half of 2006 after the closure of the xbkchat forum.

You can know about the agenda of this forum from the main page of the website http://www.brahmakumaris.info. There are also some threads devoted exclusively to this subject on the forum.

As far as I know, PBKs are not running this forum. It was basically started by some of the ex-BKs. Unlike the xbkchat forum (where PBKs were not allowed complete freedom of expression) this forum has been kind enough to accord full freedom of expression to PBKs to the same extent as any past or present member of BKWSU and all other splinter groups or individuals. It is only a coincidence (or drama plan in BK terminology) that PBKs have been active members of this forum, which gives a wrong impression to BKWSU or others that this forum is being run by PBKs.

There are several discussion fora of BKWSU where I have been a member in the past. Even simple discussions on Murlis became a cause for being banned. There was a stipulation in the forum on BKs Aussie site that every post could take more than 70 hours to appear on the screen. And here you have been given freedom of expression to criticise and abuse PBKs and ex-BKs and none of your posts have been removed. And still you doubt the agenda of this forum :-?

If you don't mind I would suggest to you to become a member of the BKs Aussie forum and try discussing with the BKs there that you are a reincarnation of Brahma Baba and see their response for yourself. :|

On Godly Service,
Arjun

[fluffy bunny]

01 Jan 1970 is just a system default for computers. It happens when you start a computer or set up a server application for the first time. The only 'official' BKWSU discussion forum, Australian BKWSU, appears to have been offline now for some months. Not only did they screen every posts, but they would not let newcomers start new topics, regularly removed complete threads and all sorts of other stuff. Anything remotely like serious discussion was stopped and, as Arjun said, no mention of the revised Murlis or revised history was allowed. It was very 'dumbed down'.

sachkhand, I read your other post regarding mr green's involvement. I was also one of the founding members. The forum was set by members of xBKChat.com when it was shut down, we understand through influence by the BKWSO. There are no PBKs involved in its running. It was started by mainly ex- or demi-BKs as a place to support others that had

• a) left the BKWSU religion and were trying to sort their lives out to share experiences,
  b) somewhere to wholly and accurately document BKWSU beliefs and lifestyle committed to making them public, and
  c) a place to help friends and family of BK (and ex-BK) members understand what their loved ones were involved with, to support and educated them

We initially intended it to be an entirely neutral place bringing together all parties instead of just serving ex-BKs such as xBKChat.com did. This which is why forums were made for BKs, PBKs and other splinters groups. Sadly, that has not worked out well mainly due to the internal culture of BKWSU, its lack of commitment to public and the 'superiority complex' attitude it breeds in its followers. But it was never intended as a place to promote BK faith.

Firstly, a minority of BKs came on with a very poor or condescending attitudes. Obviously, the warts/Murlis and all approach of this site is a great challenge to their secrecy, self-image and expensive BKWSU public PR campaign and some honest BKs remain. Secondly, we experienced the full 'war' of the relationship between various splinter groups. Then we suffered a legal action from the BKWSO, obviously intent on shutting us down and causing as much damage as possible in my opinion. And on the way we have learned.

Unfortunately, I think these incidents have tested members tolerance to the limits, created a deep resistance to the offensive or nonsensical elements of Brahma Kumarism and spoilt the atmosphere of the forum ... BUT ... despite all of that, many members have dug in and continued to do the work documenting and making public the beliefs. Arguably the internecine wars, the madness, the people thinking they are god, the broken families, the BK/ex-BK PBK/ex-PBK backstabbing and the legal intrigues ... ARE ... an whole and true documentation of BKism and the site remains as the pre-eminent resource for those interesting in BKism. And we have joked about it all.

The PBK thing is difficult at times because, obviously, PBKs share similar or equivalent faiths with the BKWSU but also share some hard life experiences with ex-BKs. Although some PBK members such as Arjun also get on with the work of documenting BKWSU beliefs and lifestyles and supporting anyone regardless of their involvement as well, others obviously use primarily it as venue to challenge or question mainstream BKism, PBKism or promote their own beliefs. That is fair enough but the PBK forum appears to more taken up entirely with an attack/defence of orthodox PBK beliefs rather than a work/support group for PBKs. On one hand, Arjun appears to have been appointed the official target by others but on the other he has chosen to use the liberty of this forum to document PBK beliefs and lifestyle.

As in any voluntary organization, more people want to sit around and chat and a few want to project their mental problems onto others rather than get down to doing some work ... but the overall structure accommodates that with relatively little censorship or direction. It would be nice if everyone just made a commitment to make a balance of, say, 10% documenting the history and what the BKWSU are getting up to, typing up Murlis etc to 90% indulgence on the forum but, largely, I think the forum and site still works overall.

[sachkhand]

AUM Shanti.
Thank you for your informative replies.
Thanks.
Sanjeev.

[fluffy bunny]

To answer a related question from another topic

Neti meti neti. I am afraid.

Is that the final outcome of your reductionist approach, or have you started your spiritual journey with 'neti neti neti'? Please reply in another thread as this may be off-topic here.

Personally, I do not think anyone touched by the BKs can intelligently progress anywhere until a full disclosure of the Murli and any previous teachings are made and the historical revisions are honestly addressed and corrected ... that it is now for the BKWSU to stop evangelising and turn within again and get their house in order.

To be used as tireless, (mostly) unrewarded evangelists at ones own, and ones family's, expense in order to expand and increase the incumbent BKWSU leadership's power base (and the financial income on which that power is based) on the promise of some jewels and golden palace in a next life IS TOTAL INSANITY ... without knowing what it is you are involved with. Here we are evidencing what individuals are involving themselves in.

We, or I personally, have got as far as to know that so much of the given truths of the BKWSU are changed and falsified. The BKWSU has been asked more than once to release or clarify the differences. It seemingly cannot and won't and why should it? Business is doing just fine as it is. It appears that once a BK follower reaches this point, the BKWSU leadership reacts neurotically or even aggressively and the individual either leaves or is banished. It is cast out of their circle hopefully to die.

No, "not this, not this, not this" is not the final outcome ... rejection of falsehood is an ongoing process I suspect to the very end of one's spiritual path or life.

One might see this forum as a stopping off point for individuals that have been through the BK machine, recognised that it is not the be all and end all as it is presented and are ready for their next challenge in life. It is here for us to share our experiences, unpick the mental conditioning, laugh about what the heck we got ourselves into, save those that are dying or drowning in the confusion it brings ... and then at some point move on.

It may be necessary, or even useful, to believe that god is as the Brahma Kumaris tells us for sometime or whatever purpose ... but it is not the final, absolute or ultimate god, What is most important is that one finds one's own path and one's own relationship with god/true/whatever and detaches from the surrogate motherhood of the BKWSU.

[pilatus]

One might see this forum as a stopping off point for individuals that have been through the BK machine, recognised that it is not the be all and end all as it is presented and are ready for their next challenge in life. It is here for us to share our experiences, unpick the mental conditioning, laugh about what the heck we got ourselves into, save those that are dying or drowning in the confusion it brings ... and then at some point move on.

That about sums it up for me... :D

And whether PBKs are running this forum

I don't know where you're getting this from sanjeev - the forum is clearly mainly driven by ex-BKs with input welcomed from BKs, PBKs etc not the other way round ...

It seems to me that your personal experience with PBKs is heavily influencing your input/approach to the forum - just be aware that most of us earned our scars with the BK's not the PBKs ...

Best wishes

[paulkershaw]

Sanjeev,

much of the info you ask about is posted on the 'home page' of this forum.

[patsan31]

Could you please explain me why this forum is started ?

[paulkershaw]

All the information you are looking for is on the forum's home page, you need to take the time to read it all and you will find the answers. For instance at the top of this page you will see the following "buttons" :- Intro- The BKWSU - Mediumship - Destruction etc etc, click on them (at the right hand top of the page) and this will provide you with the information. You will also find this in many other threads and posts, some of which you say you have already read and come to a conclusion about.

[patsan31]

Thanks for the information,

Could you please explain me how this thing happens? It is really frustrating. Then I think the normal people are very happy who do not get into this (Spirituality).

[paulkershaw]

Please explain what you mean by "this thing happen?" I personally do not understand your question. Try to say it again in another manner or way and do be more clear in what you are asking please. What "thing"?

[mr green]

Could you please explain me how this thing happens?. It is really frustrating. Then I think the normal people are very happy who do not get into this (Spirituality )

Who are the normal people?

[pilatus]

Who are the normal people?

Perhaps those I seem to remember the BK's referring to as "simple souls"? Some of my family members are not into spirituality as though it's something separate from "normal" life but they're very good to be around - relaxed, happy, content with life ...

[sachkhand]

AUM Shanti.

(on 29 Jul 2008) It seems to me that your personal experience with PBKs is heavily influencing your input/approach to the forum - just be aware that most of us earned our scars with the BK's not the PBKs ...

NO. I have not come here to settle scores with anyone. Yes I used to get very angry and frustrated when hearing this tussle between BKWSU and AIVV members. I also used to get angry on Brahma Baba and even complain to Shiv in my own childish ways. I had very good experience in Kampil. I have experienced very deep Love in the eyes of Virendra Dev Dixit couple of times. But I did not always follow the meditation as taught by Virendra Dev Dixit. I used to give more attention on being and experiencing I, the soul.

I have read in Murli that " atma abhimani hai to Baap saath hai hi." meaning if (one) is soul conscious then Father is obviously with (him). I joined this forum to share my feelings and experiences and to share my churnings of Murli points. Why? Because by sharing we open ourself to be criticised and we can analyse our ideas, thoughts and experiences in a better way. We can correct our real mistakes that are pointed at by others and if there is Truth in our ideas, thoughts and experiences we get a chance to test them. That's all.

I hope you people i.e., ex-BKs too not try to settle scores with BKs but give attention to understand The GodFatherly knowledge. I am not saying that you should not try to know the actual history of Yagnya and about it's literature. You can keep trying for it. But can we understand The GodFather by reading literature and early Yagnya history? Even if The GodFather Himself comes in front of us and gives us His introduction, can we recognise Him just with our intellect and our extrnal eyes?

Murli dt: 19-4-85, page 2: "It is not that (people) do not know only Supreme Soul. Even do not know soul. If (people) understand soul then will immediately understand Supreme Soul. Child knows oneself and does not know Father then how is it possible".

So, best of luck for you all in your seeking.
Thanks.
Sanjeev.

[pilatus]

Hello again sanjeev,

I am glad that you had "very good experience". As you might read elsewhere on the forum, like (at least) some others here, my experiences were mixed. My choice of non-BK (rather than ex-BK) when I joined the forum was quite deliberate. It indicated that I had been at most an irregular student and not as committed to the BK path as some other forum members. That's why you'll find that I am not one of those looking for copies of Murlis - BK Godly knowledge is no longer of any interest to me. In that sense, I have moved on but like to play my part in the ex-BK world through this forum ...

Best regards,