Welcome Mbbhat

[mbbhat]

Dear Souls,

Every soul is independent and dependent. Each of us has some individual aim and mutual relationship with other. We live in society. The first one refers to maintain respect and the second is the give respect. Raja Yoga is giving the highest respect to self and to the other. Highest status is Child of God (soul). So considering self as soul and the other as soul is giving highest status to self and the same status to the other. It is like giving/sharing all I have with the other. But for this, one has to realize God. When we meet a stranger, we give respect. If the views of two are different, then we get separated. But we do not become enemy. [This is a big topic; I have explained shortly].

Similarly, as soon as a person become Bk, he decides his path of life. He gives knowledge to others(his family people or anybody are like starngers). If others agree, it is fine. Otherwise, definitely there will be detachment. If both realize and respect each other, it is fine. Otherwise, there will be separation. It is obvious.

Even in a family, parents send their children abroad for jobs or higher studies. They sacrifice their attachment for benefit of their children. So is a normal man considers there is benefit by sacrificing lust, he should feel happiness and support him. If he does not realize, he may hate.

Even when my mother had to observe celibacy, there was quarrel in our house. After one month, Father realized and gave permission. You see- now there is double benefit. Father also became pure! Initially (just after becoming BK), mother started cooking onion in a separate vessel for Father separately. After some years, my Father reduced onion intake. Now, sometimes he prepares himself onion food! Internal respect has developed in him! Now there is only one problem to me. My Father is not satisfied by me doing money service to Baba. It is not his wrong. He says make savings. You will need for future. He has no interest in my money but he has attachment as usual. I had some strong arguments with him in this matter. Sometimes, he used to take this issue with my mother and disturb her.

You see problems will be there when there is life. Just by commenting BKs, one gets nothing. It is like spitting towards sky. There are numerous people in this world who do 100 times more sin than BKs. I am not blaming you. I have to explain to the depth. I do not have any other option. All are caught in this Drama which is 80% sweet and 20% bitter.

[mbbhat]

Dear bansy soul,

Wait and see. Your comments are invited. Today I have the capacity of not getting influenced by any girl. I can challange this to anybody. I can stand nude and you can show me anything. You can play any music. (Of course, the sound level should not be too high to be a violence). I will not be influenced. Even video camera can be put on to capture. I can still go further. But this much is enough. But still Baba has not told me to do all these.

I will tell you one incidence. I requested BK centres to announce "Gita kaa bhagavaan Shiva and not Krishna" as Baba says in the Murli that it is very important service. But nodbody was ready. I did not get support/permission from any centre. Baba has also said, "tumhen ek mat hokar rahnaa hai", so I kept quiet. I was ready 3 years before. I have requested around 20 times to different Senior and Junior tecahers even Zonal heads. But they were not bold. So I kept quiet. But this year, after hearing the same point many times in Murli, I could not wait. I thought if death comes before this, then what is the use of my life? Then I did service myself alone (with Baba in mind) at four places. There were both praises and criticism.

The fourth place was was far from my native place. When dissatisfied people came to know that I was alone there, they (10 to 15 people) came the second day (service was for three days), beat me and took me to the police station (even the police supported these people). All the calenders, literatures were taken by them. I was in police station for nearly 8 hours. In the police station, as I had answer for all the question. They left me on the same day even if those people had asked them to keep me in custody till next evening as they had fear if I continue service on the third day, since I had paid rent for that place where a big fair was organized (around 200 stalls of 100 sq.ft). Actually I could have complained very easily on them since it is out of law for the police to enter without permission of the organizing committe. But since I had faith in Drama, I did not do anything.

Even while they were beating, I did not think any bad about them since, I was alone and was moun(silence) and had a calm state. More things are there to explain.

I got the following quote you posted somewhere else. Even I was also told like that. But I just follow Murli and do not listen what BK teachers' views.

I was told that whenever you listen to or read the Murli, then you have to "imagine" it was Dada Lekhraj (Brahma Baba) sitting in front of you speaking at the current time since he was the Chariot, and because this is still the Confluence Age and the Confluence Age did not stop in 1969. So you have to read whatever Murli, e.g. even today's morning, as if it was as it fresh today as back then, and not mind if this was 1967 or 1997 whatever.

So the Murli is God's flute with Dada Lekhraj adding his interpretation. That seemed and still seems easy to accept for most who come in contact with BKs at the start of their BK journey, after all the intoxication is probably at it's highest because you had just been "long lost but now found" children.

Now the problem comes for those who had wished/still wishing to study deeper, after all Gyan is one of the 4 subjects for each pukka BK and we want to be obedient children to God. We began to run out of material to study and/or we forget and cannot understand parts of the Murli so need to ask, or points were repeating, or the Avyakt Murlis from BapDada seasonal meetings through the body of Dadi Gulzar did/do not add to Gyan but give more essence only to seva (service).

We also begin to find out there are only 5 years of such Sakar Murlis, and these are getting revised with possibly parts missing during each revision (as claimed by PBKs), and BKs are not allowed access to the originals even though we are his children and the Murlis are part of "inheritance" but that needs approval by the BK administration. So the Murli is still God's flute, except no BK dares to try to interpret them the way Dada Lekraj did when he was alive.

(In adding to the last sentence, and I think the practice is still happening. The BK on the gaddi reading the Murlis in class to occasionally intervenes with his/her interpretation of the Murli, and asking the audience as if to wake them up. This I found irritating, as it meant that person understood the Murli fully. Thus the person on the gaddi, is on par with Dada Lekhraj).

So will we get anything fresh ? Will Shiva pass messages and knowledge to Brahma Baba (soul) who then enters the human Chariot Dadi Gulzar about more details of the things to come (e.g. destruction), or will Shiva enter the human Chariot of Veerendra Dev Diksit. Or maybe even both ?

I am new to this forum. Since Baba has told "Our sang tod, ek sang jod" [Leave all other company and get engaged in one company], I cannot say to what extent I will spend time here. Because remembering Baba for 8 hours per day is the real aim in our life. Something more ...

In the beginning itself, when I came to Gyan and I was sitting in class, I was listening Murli as though ShivBaba is talking to me in Paramdham. I was visualizing just two points in Paramdham and power flows from one point (ShivBaba) to the other(me). This has given me the highest bliss in my life. Even when I die, I will have more happiness than sorrow. Today also I do Yoga just by remembering two points. I do not remember Brahma Baba or sookshmavatan (Subtle Region) in Yoga.

Since I have got such an inner power from Murli, my heart says, Murli cannot be wrong. In fact, I came to know that Murli was spoken through Brahma later. Initially, I had faith in point of light form on the day of the course itself. I had got 50% of the one week course as I was not very much interested in all the calendars. I was just interested in God and dieties. I got faith that God is point of light, so is the soul and got the knowledge of ladder. This was enough for me at that time.

At the age of 8, I was devotee of SriVishnu. My mother used to narrate stories of Ramayana and mahabhaarat (Hindu epics) from the age 4th year. I got Bk knowledge in 11th year (1982).

During my first visit to madhuban, I and all those who were assembled in Madhuban, was told to remember ShivBaba in Gulzar Dadi's forehead. But I was not getting much happiness in it. Even on that day of BapDada's milan on 21-01-87, I forgot the whole world while sitting in Universal Peace Hall. For around three minutes (perhaps), there was no thought in my mind. There was practically no thought. Just two points in Paramdham. This picture was in my mind. And there was a feeling of strong power which had everything; love, peace, bliss ... flowing from one point to the other(me). That stage was at least 1,000 times more powerful than when I expected ShivBaba's drishti on the stage in front of Gulzar Dadi while receiving toli.

Please excuse me as I am also going out of the topic of the thread.

[bansy]

?

I can see you are very keen but can you make your posts in easy portions, as it is not possible to read your posts on the screen of my device, as well as having several various back to back posts.

[global]

Mhbhat,

Are you married or have you been? If you are single than it is very ignornant of you to offer advice to those who are married.

Please stop quoting from Murli points which you cannot say are true unless you heard it directly from the mouth of Dada Lekhraj. Your Murli quoting only suits the purpose of those you try to protect and represent.

It is like me working for the Dairy Industry and telling you, "You should drink milk because it is good for you."

I am not typing that the Murli did not exist but do not believe that they are pure any more.

I agree the bond between child and mother is very unique those who have not gone through this can not understand we can try to understand but it is not possible.

[fluffy bunny]

Mhbhat,

I have read over your posts and recognise the state of mind you are in. Do you not realise that many or most of us are have experienced exactly that same state of mind? Part intoxication, part tailspin ... (downward corkscrew path of an airplane about to crash).

Will you not stop for a minute, take a deep breath, and ask us first what we know before repeating EVERYTHING that we do know and have heard so many times.

Honestly my friend, you are have been deeply mentality conditioned. That is all most of it is. Mental conditioning that acts as a smokescreen for what is really going on behind the scenes. You are giving away your life and losing your soul. Not gaining the Golden Age inheritance.

Firstly, most of what you are repeating is just stuff you have heard. There is no "Proof" to it. There is no perfect equation. Please start with the original documents you find in the History forum, read over them, see that there is a different reality to the one you have been force fed day in day out.

If you want to sit on a guddhi and "give The Knowledge", I do not think this is the place to do it. If you want to address some of the problems that exist in the BKWSU, then stick around and join us.

Welcome to the forum.

[mbbhat]

Dear ex-l soul,

Actually, I wanted to explain the matter slowly and deeply. But you called me a SALESMAN! And this forced me to write instant answers.

This is natural when when there is expectation. You want what you desire. You are not ready to listen what is written. Of course, it is not wrong. But if this forum is open and impartial, you should allow anybody to express their views. But it seems that you need details from which you can defame BKs. Baba has told, "Impure wishes are fulfilled by Maya". So even those wishes will be fulfilled. Carry On.

I am really a salesman having no expectation! I do not expect somebody to follow me. Like ShivBaba needs nothing from anybody, he just shows right path to all. Similarly, this is my effort to show right path according to my capacity. I do not say to follow what I say. But why are you upset?

Something more. In Bhaktimarg (Copper Age and Iron Age), devotees worship different Gods like Hanuman, Ganesh, etc who are imaginary gods. Still Baba gives them vision of those! (God himself gives the vision to devotees who are non-existing!). You see, Shiva Baba is also bound in this drama. To know the introduction of soul, knowledge of body is also needed. Otherwise, it will be half. Similarly, to know fully about ShivBaba, knowledge of Drama is also needed.

Baba has also said, knowledge will sit only in those heads which remain pure. So the knowledge will sit only in those few BKs who wish to become pure.

I will always keep aim in positive thinking. Even if you prove to be true, I am happy. Do you know why? Because I will be happy to see you happy. I will not become unhappy because I have already gained what I needed. Even if that is your case, let it be. I respect you also. I am not dissatisfied by you. I still wish you all the best in your every action.

You see - sometimes for children - we say "Do not go there. The demon will catch you". That lie is for their advantage. So even if Baba has spoken about Destruction, it need not be correct. Baba might have told to accelerate children's effort! You know, the story of the wolf and the boy who was looking after sheeps? First he lied, "Wolf came". He lied second time. But the third time, wolf definitely came! So it is actually the significance of Destruction. Wait and see.

Even if many BKs turn to be PBKs I am happy. My rank in BKs will be better. Even if you prove BrahmaBaba was wrong, I will be happy; my rank will be better. If somebody proves to be more pure than me in PBKs, I will bow my head to them.

• If the Destruction takes place very fast, I am happy. Because my sweet Baba's work is completed.
  If the Destruction takes place later, I am happy, because my dear brothers will get more time to do purusharthah and I also can enjoy Sangamyug more.

I am not greedy for the Golden Age. A true RajaYogi will not be tempted by Satyugi Narayan status. I will be happy to give that status even to PBKs or anybody, because all are children of my sweet beloved ShivBaba.

I am fully satisfied by you. I expected this (your dis-satisfaction). The reason is - all of us have ego. This is the reason why it is very difficult for ShivBaba to speak. In the whole world, people are either egoistic or dull heads. So, the Murli will not enter into any head. Just see. Science is called the highest knowledge today. Science believes no soul. Then can you explain love, peace, etc scientifically? I have written with proofs in my files which I had uploaded.

To some extent, it is correct that I also do not listen. Because many things are silly in this forum. Not only that - a egoistic man and satisfied man both will not listen. So time will prove to what extent who is correct. That is why all is Drama! Baba has said many times, "Drama is even more powerful than me". So highest is drama, second Baba and next is Maya. You are just bother what is written in papers. You cannot read hearts! Many people eat food by calculating calories, not its natural power!

Please excuse me to say this! . No - actually, there is no need to ask excuse because I have not done any mistake here. I can just say - you are a sweet soul and just give you spiritual love and respect. Baba also says sweet children (love) in the beginning and namaste (respect) in the end!

So, it is up to you either to give me permission to post here or not.

According to me, one should have this attitude; one should be ready to sell his goods. But should not feel bad if it is not sold. That is the true spirit.

A donor never thinks bad if somebody does not accepts his gift. He will give it to some other people. Similarly, in Satya Yug, seats are limited. If you do not wish, it is OK for me. But it is up to you decide whether you are going to cut my relation with other people in this forum or not.

[mbbhat]

Dear Global soul,

I can explain logically also. I have plans to explain the knowldge without Murli. A true intellectual is one who can give knowledge without taking Murli. I have already written books and writing. But in this forum, when many people ask many things (some have asked Murli points specifically), I had to quote. My aim is to explain the things with Murli (as some need) and without it also. You can see my quotes in the beginning which had no quotes. But when somebody asked me Murli points, I started quoting. That's all.

[fluffy bunny]

Rather just provide the entire Murlis so that we can decide for ourselves what the quote means. We are collecting the entire set. Make sure your quotes are dated so that we can check the revisions. Thank you.

"Baba says in the Murli ..." followed by a quote out of context is the typical stick of many a center-in-charge used to beat poor young BKs with.

[mbbhat]

Dear Ex-1,

I had informed that at present, I am far from my native place and my documents are not available with me. When I go there, it would be possible and then quote the dates.
At least those who are interested, can check whether those points are sain in Murli. Not only that, many interested people here may recognize that "Oh- yes, Baba had said that in Murli". Even without mentioning dates, there may be use.

[mbbhat]

Dear ex-l soul,

I do not have the entire set of Murli. I have good relation with some centres but some centre BKs suspected me, since I am not a regular student and I do not take active part in usual services. But now their doubt is decreasing. I had also received a news that "BKs had thought mbbhat had left knowledge" because for a period of nearly three months I had not been to centre at all. I used to read 4 to 8 Murlis daily and this gave me good power.

But one thing: I had said, we should know how to give preference in our life. In Murli the importance goes like this:

1) Remember me always; This point Baba will speak everyday.
2) Conquer lust or maintain purity(celibacy); This point Baba will speak say once in a week.
3) Remember Baba with Love in amrutavela(early morning); This Baba will say around three times in a month. Next importance is Give my introduction to others.

Next preferences are;
4) Maintain pure food, Maintain daily chart, listen Murli everyday etc.

Like this it goes. If one is interested in Murli, he has to check how many times Baba has repeated a point. Give that the most preference. The mistake made in BK institution is that the importance to purity of food is given more importance than the initial points. Then definitely some imbalance will be there. That is the result what we see.

But still, we cannot say that it is incorrect. Because it is not possible to remember Baba always as soon as you come to Gyan. One cannot conquer lust immediately. There is fighting with Maya. But there is need of some discipline to run an institution. So food should be pure. Not only, that it is one of the needed one itself. So it is not mistake. But the mistake is - the attitudes of BKs - like if a Bk takes food from outside, he gets lower status than others. Due to other BKs' wrong attitudes, this poor Bk considers himself as untouchable in the divine family and the Bk family instead of supporting him, becomes an instrument in lowering him.

Today many BKs do not know that I take food from outside occassionally. I am not hiding it. I have disclosed to somebody. But when I disclosed, those BKs did not have power to tolerate at all! Just an example; Suppose if a BK visits his friend's house, if the TV is running and his friends are watching, the Bk will change his eyes from that TV instantly. {Previously, I was also doing like that. Now I also will take part with them for couple of minutes, depending on the situation and talk in a friendly manner, and gently leave the place as soon as possible without making them negative feeling]. This would create a communication gap between the Bk and the friend and whatever service you do, will not be effective.

But, one cannot say that these rules in BKs are wrong. Why? See the next post.

[mbbhat]

Is there need of strict rules in BKs?

For a child we do not give full access. We keep it away from substances like knife, glass, etc. Because it is incapable in handling it. Similarly, in BKs it is wrong to touch, hug etc. Why? Because in Indian culture, even today, if a male touches another female(except his wife and children), it is treated as sin. Not only that- Even if a person kisses or touches his wife in front of others, others will not feel comfortable. You see- the world is large. There are many religions, culture, etc. Baba's message has to be given to all.

If a western culture Bk touches or kisses another Bk in his country, it will be OK. It will not become dis- service. But if it is allowed there, then the same BKs if hug or touch when they visit Madhuban in India, it will become very difficult for Indian BKs! You see- it is not easy to run an institution. In your place kissing in public is normal. Even today, in TV we see many politicians touch face to face while greeting each other. That's OK for you. But it will be a difficult in India. Hence there is need of these disciplines in BKs institutions.

In home also, when parents engage in lustful action, they do not do it in front children. Because children will become uncomfortable. Similarly,this hugging, kissing etc are in Bk family would be problem to others. I am writing this- because in this forum, there are comments about these.

[But- even when these rules are present, if a Bk student commits mistake, he should be loved by senior BKs like Baba loves each and every child. Every Bk(even teacher or senior) should consider other BKs as their own children and show mercy(kshama) on them so that the Bk will get happy and power to sacrifice his negativities. But this is lacking. All are not ShivBaba or BrahmaBaba. Baba says in Murli all these points. One who inculcates these first is the real Arjun. They get higher ranks. In Golden Age, all are needed- Kings, servants, citizens, etc. This is the reason why BKs become numberwise eventhough they hear same Murlis!]

[mbbhat]

Dear ex-l soul,

• If there is truth, there is no need of law.
  If there is love, there is no need of respect.
  If there is character, there is no need of discipline.

But till the first three are achieved, there is need of next three things.

[fluffy bunny]

If there are those 3 ... then better that they are all written down very clearly so that everyone can see and understand them, and all changes are recorded.

Does that infer that we need judges, jailers and police force too?

[mbbhat]

THAT'S NOT MEANT FOR YOU. I MEANT IT AS NECESSITY FOR A SYSTEM TILL IT BECOMES PERFECT.

[fluffy bunny]

I read that. I mean it for the BK system ... where is the BK judiciary, the Court of Indra, where we can take our concerns. How does the BKWSU police its followers, they are more in number than a major city now. And what limitations or punishments exist for the BK criminals? It strikes me some of them are running the show right now.