Meaning of Avaykt Bap-Dada.

[andrey]

But if we remember the 100% incorporeal stage of Ram Bap it would be the same full stop. There is a lot of praise of the point like stage even in the recent Avyakt Vanis. This is not wrong a stage.

It is different to remember a point of light in a body and a point of light without a body. The first will lead to stable stage of the mind whilst in the body, other will lead to leaving the body.

[pbkdivya]

I meant to say: Shiv=Incorporeal Ram. Shankar=Confluence-Aged Ram, who is also Prajapita and Bharat. I did not mean to say that Shiv=Ram=Prajapita=Bharat, as you are inferring.

I agree.

[andrey]

I have been watching a discussion VCD, where it used to be said that the same way as in one body there is the Sun and the Moon of Knowledge, the same way we children will also be, because our children will be entering us.

[shivsena]

I meant to say: Shiv=Incorporeal Ram. Shankar=Confluence-Aged Ram, who is also Prajapita and Bharat. I did not mean to say that Shiv=Ram=Prajapita=Bharat, as you are inferring.

Dear arjun Bhai.

Can you give any Murli quote which directly says that Shankar is confluence aged Ram and prajapita and Bharat?

shivsena.

[button slammer]

Audio Cassette No.302f, at Kampil
Clarification of Murli dated 26.02.69 & Avyakt Vani dated 01.06.77
Ref. No.Audio Cass.-302-Part-III-Eng.

'According to the drama, the task of world service is bound to succeed. The task (that is to take place) according to the drama cannot stop due to someone creating some obstacle. No one can shake. It is BapDada who is instrumental (nimitt). What does ‘instrumental’ mean? Baap and Dada, both are instrumental in combined form. It means that they are in corporeal form. (They are instrumental) to give multimillion times fruit for every action. If they do well, they would get multimillion times (fruit). And if they perform acts of disservice, even then they would get multimillion times (punishment). He makes the children instrumental for service. If they do, they would get multimillion times. So, in order to create the fortune of the children, BapDada has been made instrumental. What has been said? Who has made? You may say that the Supreme Soul Father has made instrumental or you may say that drama has made (instrumental). Who has been made instrumental? BapDada. So, who is Baap and who is Dada? Prajapita is the Father (Baap) and what about Dada? Brahma. Nevertheless, any task does not shake if anyone shakes. It is predetermined for every cycle (Kalpa) that we are bound to be victorious. That is why, change such language of weakness, i.e. cause benefit to the self'. :)

[arjun]

Can you give any Murli quote which directly says that Shankar is confluence aged Ram and Prajapita and Bharat?

Dear brother,

Om Shanti. I don't think that any such Murli quote is available. But it has definitely been said that all the glory belongs to the Father. Depending on the tasks that have been performed in the Confluence Age, the Father has been named variously. Well, the incorporeal Father has only one name, i.e. Shiv based on His soul. But when He enters the appointed Chariot to perform various tasks, then ShivBaba (i.e. the combination of incorporeal Shiv and His appointed Chariot) gets various names likes Shankar, Prajapita, Bharat, Confluence-Aged Ram/Krishna, etc.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

[shivsena]

So, who is Baap and who is Dada? Prajapita is the Father (Baap) and what about Dada? Brahma. Nevertheless, any task does not shake if anyone shakes. It is predetermined for every cycle (Kalpa) that we are bound to be victorious. That is why, change such language of weakness, i.e. cause benefit to the self'.[/color]

According to advance knowledge, avaykt BapDada means combined Ram and Krishna in avaykt-vatan(ie subtle angelic world). If you state that baap is Ram prajapita and Dada is brahma, then why is it said in Murlis that prajapita cannot be in the Subtle Region; and if what is said in cds is considered right, then Murlis and avaykt Vanis contradict each other.
shivsena.

[new knowledge]

What's the difference between BapDada, ShivBaba & Shankar? All these three terms are believed (by PBKs) to be various combinations of souls of Shiv, Ram & Krishna.

• 1) Does BapDada mean combination of Ram & Krishna?
  2) Does ShivBaba mean combination of Shiv & Ram?
  3) Does Shankar means combination of Shiv, Ram & Krishna?

Shanka (i.e, Shiv+Ram+Krishna) = BapDada (i.e, Ram+Krishna) + ShivBaba (i.e, Shiv+Ram)????

[arjun]

1) Does BapDada mean combination of Ram & Krishna?
2) Does ShivBaba mean combination of Shiv & Ram?
3) Does Shankar means combination of Shiv, Ram & Krishna?
Shankar (i.e, Shiv+Ram+Krishna) = BapDada(i.e, Ram+Krishna) + ShivBaba(i.e, Shiv+Ram)????

Dear brother,

Om Shanti. According to PBKs, BapDada means combination of (Shiv+Ram) + (Krishna).
2 & 3 as described by you are correct. But the inference that you have drawn, i.e. Shankar=BapDada+ShivBaba is not correct because Shiv is common in BapDada as well as ShivBaba.

You could say Shankar=BapDada :D
or
Shankar=ShivBaba + Krishna :).

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

[shivsena]

Om Shanti. According to PBKs, BapDada means combination of (Shiv+Ram) + (Krishna).

Dear arjun Bhai,

If you say avaykt BapDada means 'shiv+Ram' and 'Krishna', then can you please clarify what is nirakar shiv doing in avaykt-vatan, as it is said in Murlis that shiv does not come in anybody in avaykt-vatan.

shivsena

[arjun]

If you say avaykt BapDada means 'Shiv+Ram' and 'Krishna', then can you please clarify what is nirakar Shiv doing in avaykt-vatan, as it is said in Murlis that Shiv does not come in anybody in avaykt-vatan.

I clarified only the meaning of 'BapDada' as told to me by ShivBaba (through Baba Virendra Dev Dixit) and not the meaning of 'Avyakt BapDada'.

You know very well that all PBKs believe Father Shiv to be working through Shankar (believed to be Baba Virendra Dev Dixit by me), so the question of Father Shiv being in the Subtle Region does not arise at all.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

[shivsena]

I clarified only the meaning of 'BapDada' as told to me by ShivBaba (through Baba Veerendra Dev Dixit) and not the meaning of 'Avyakt BapDada'.

Can you please ask the meaning of "avaykt BapDada" to ShivBaba.
shivsena.

[arjun]

Can you please ask the meaning of "avaykt BapDada" to ShivBaba.

Dear brother,

Om Shanti. I could ask this question on your behalf, but since you do not believe any of the words spoken by ShivBaba through the body of Baba Virendra Dev Dixit, I do not think it is wise enough to get an answer only to be criticized by you as a creation of Mayavi Krishna.

You have his emailid. It is better you obtain the answer yourself and repoduce here as Mayavi Krishna's reply to your question.

I seek your pardon in advance for the above views.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

[shivsena]

Om Shanti. I could ask this question on your behalf, but since you do not believe any of the words spoken by ShivBaba through the body of Baba Veerendra Dev Dixit, I do not think it is wise enough to get an answer only to be criticized by you as a creation of Mayavi Krishna. You have his emailid. It is better you obtain the answer yourself and repoduce here as Mayavi Krishna's reply to your question.

Dear arjun Bhai.

Yes-- you are very right; i had asked 10 queries to Baba through email about 8 years back and i got such foolish answers, which then made me turn towards Murlis to do my own research (apni ghot toh nasha chade) and find out the answers myself and ever since my research is giving me convincing answers about this present mayavi role of Krishna to lead the children away from nirakari Ramshivbaba. So i am never going to write to him or ask him any queries through email; whenever we meet in any sangatan, then i will surely ask him many queries which i have in mind.

shivsena.

[suryavanshi]

At the end of every Murli, it is said that " Mithe-mithe roohaani bacchon prati maat pitaa baapdada kaa Yaad pyar aur good morning. Roohani Baap ki roohani bacchon ko namaste."

Since this forum is already discussing about BapDada, who are/is referred to as Maat - Pitaa and BapDada here?

Are Maat Pita and BapDada the same souls?