8 Topmost souls

[fluffy bunny]

I don't think this has been cleared up in this thread, where subsequent discussions above has somehow asssumed Mr Patel was to be head of the Aryasamajis, though this is not proven.

I asked this before ... what is the big deal of becoming the head of the Arya Samaj if it just started in the 1870s?

[arjun]

However, my query is why in the quoted Q&A did Baba mention that Mr Patel can become the head of the Aryasamajis. Is there some special qualities of the soul of Mr Patel that aligns him to be in that role?

Sorry, I forgot to answer this question. I remember hearing in some clarification Murlis that Aryasamajis have a speciality of publishing a lot of literature and Mr. Patel also got a lot of literature published while he was a PBK and even after the establishment of the Vishnu Party.

"Arya Samajis read a lot of scriptures ... Aryasamajis distribute books, don't they?" [Revised Sakar Murli dated 25-2-73 Pg-3 published by BKs, narrated by Father Shiv through Brahma Baba]
Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

Note: Translation done by PBKs.

[arjun]

what is the big deal of becoming the head of the Arya Samaj if it just started in the 1870s?

Yes, there is not much deal in becoming the head of Arya Samaj because, unlike other 8 religions depicted in the Kalpa Tree, the Arya Samajis (and the atheists, i.e. Communists) do not enjoy kingship in the real sense. It is only a rule of subjects over subjects. Even if Kingship existed in some Princely states under the colonial rule, it was titular, which was purchased from the erstwhile Colonial Rulers by paying them hefty amounts. The shooting/rehearsal for that also takes place in the Confluence-Aged world of Brahmins.

"The title of Maharaja has gone, but even then, if one wishes, he can retain the title by giving one or two lakhs of rupees to the Congress (party)." [Revised Sakar Murli dated 12-6-74 Pg-3 published by the BKs and narrated by Father Shiv through Brahma Baba]

While the arrival of Aryasamajis in India was very soon followed by the arrival of democracy, the arrival of Communists in Russia led to the overthrow of the Czars. Even the Communist rule in Russia could not last long and the USSR also got disintegrated into many countries.

But the seed-like soul of the Arya Samaj does not come from the Soul World in 1870s but has been in this world since the beginning of the Golden Age. It fathers the person in whom the soul of Dayanad Saraswati enters from the Soul World to establish Arya Samaj.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

[pbktrinityshiva]

Perhaps there is more talk of them now as they are visible at this time. In what form and where do we find Arya Samaji's outside of Bharat?

[arjun]

Perhaps there is more talk of them now as they are visible at this time. In what form and where do we find Arya Samaji's outside of Bharat?

Om Shanti. Are you talking about the souls with characteristics of Arya Samaj within the seed-like/root-like souls outside India? Or are you talking about the actual Arya Samajis of the outside world?

In case you are talking about the souls with characteristics of Arya Samaj within the seed-like/root-like souls outside India, then I have already mentioned one of the features. Apart from that another feature is that they want the number of followers to increase without paying attention to the quality. Just as the Arya Samajis allow anyone (from any religious or social background) to become an Arya Samaji (Hindu), the seed-like/root-like souls of Arya Samaj within the Brahmin family would allow anyone to become a BK/PBK without caring about their background/dharana/interest in knowledge etc. In the Advance Course on Kalpa Tree while speaking about the salient features of the seed-like/root-like souls of this religion within the Brahmin family ShivBaba (through Baba Virendra Dev Dixit) has asked, "... is it better to produce one lion-like child or produce many jackal-like children?"

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

[pbktrinityshiva]

Hi Arjun, Om Shanti.

Yes i am talking about the Arya Samaji's in the outside world not the seeds or roots.

I was just wondering as I have never heard the term Arya Samaj used outside of Bharat so I wondered where can they be found in the rest of the world? What particular institutions etc because they must be somehow part of the institution of democracy? Groups such as Christians and Muslims etc are very visible and even atheists.

Regards,
TS

[arjun]

I was just wondering as I have never heard the term Arya Samaj used outside of Bharat so I wondered where can they be found in the rest of the world? What particular institutions etc because they must be somehow part of the institution of democracy?

As ex-l has pointed out the Arya Samajis have been in existence for just over a century. Although they are a minority among the Hindus, they still have a sizeable number in India and you can find Arya Samaj Temples in almost every major Indian city. But although their total strength may be more than the BKs, but the number of their temples in India must be lesser than the BK centers at present, I suppose. The Arya Samajis run a lot of educational institutions in India known as DAV Public schools. They try to inculcate the Indian values in their students besides teaching them good things from the Hindu scriptures.

They must be definitely having a presence outside India also, but they may be maintaining a low profile, unlike the other Hindu temples, which are very grand in foreign countries. The Arya Samajis do not worship deities and believe in the incorporeal form of God. All their religious activities revolve around organizing yagyas (sacrificial fires) along with the recitation of mantras from the Vedas. I think you may get some weblinks about the activities of Arya Samaj outside India if you search on Google.

Once the Arya Samajis of a North Indian city had organized a public debate with BKs (a Senior Sister and two senior brothers from Delhi had participated in the debate). Some PBKs got to know about the programme and went to attend it with the permission of the organizers. The BKs could neither answer the questions of the Arya Samajis to their satisfaction and when a couple of PBKs started raising general questions they got down from the stage in an angry mood and walked away.

Regards,
OGS,
Arjun

[pbktrinityshiva]

Om Shanti Arjun, Your reply is much appreciated.

Regards, TS

[arjun]

Prashna: Kya topmost 8 aatmaen 8 dharmon ki aatmaen arthaat Ashta Ratan hain ya fir Ashta Dev?
Uttar: 8 shrestha aatmayen shreshtha kul say niklenge, shreshtha tey shrestha toh suryavanshi hain. Shreshtha aatmayen ashta dev hi hain. Astharatan toh 8 dharm kay heads hain.

Question: Are the topmost 8 souls the souls belonging to 8 religions, i.e. 8 gems or the 8 deities?
Ans: 8 righteous souls would emerge from the righteous clans. The most righteous ones are those belonging to the Sun Dynasty. The 8 deities alone are the righteous souls. The 8 gems are the heads of the 8 religions.

[fluffy bunny]

Narrative : Baba (Lekhraj Kirpalani) had visions. Returning to Calcutta, Baba found jewels as stones, and in company with his partner ...

Lekhraj Kirpalani : Sevakram, relieve me. I've lost all interest in trade. Close up partnership.
Sevakram : Lakhiraj, How you say so. Who shall manage all this. I don't know even a bit.

Narrative : Whatever partner decided, Baba accepted and sent home a telegram. (telegram extract : The first partner found God and the second a false kingdom. The first one received a call to forsake all for the goal.)

There is no date of print of the comic.

Just wanted to revive this thread and compare it to recent postings in the subject. My, how we have prgressed!

[paulkershaw]

The 8 deities alone are the righteous souls. The 8 gems are the heads of the 8 religions

Well, that's all clear to me now now. This details a reason why there are so many Bk/PbK/PbbbbbbK and Anti-Bk 'spiritual' parties starting up. We can expect 8 'Baba' parties in total and the head of each one will become top dog.

The rest of ya may as well give up and come party with us in nawty nawty Thailand ... you've got no chance at all anymore. Unless, of course, one decides to start up your own Bk style spiritual organisation and take out the opposition as they become a threat. :|

[suryavanshi]

If Krishna does not play an all round part than why is it repeatedly mentioned in Murlis that "Full 84 births in 5000 years are for Krishna only" why is it never mentioned in Murlis that ''Ram takes full 84 births''?

If it is said that "Full 84 births in 5000 years are for Krishna only", then it is also said that Krishna also does not take full 84 births. The Murli point to support this is below:

• "Pehle number mein hai Shri Krishna - First Prince,Shri Narayan toh baad mein bantaa hai jab badaa hota hai. Wah bhi 20-25 varsh kam ho jaatein hai, unkein bhi poore 84 janma nahi kahenge. Number one hai(Sanganyugi) Shri Krishna." Sakar Murli ,10/9/01 / pg.1.
  
  (Shri Krishna is in first number-First Prince, he becomes Shri Narayan after he is grown up. Which will reduce 20-25 years,for him also full 84 births cannot be mentioned.Number one is (Sangamyugi) Shri Krishna.)
  
  "Poore 84 janma 5000 hazaar varsh Shri Krishna kein hi kahenge" Sakar Murli , 10/9/01/pg1
  
  (Full 84 births 5000 yrs. will be said for Shri Krishna only).

These 2 Murli points talk about two Krishna ... one is samgamyugi (Confluence-Aged) Krishna (who takes complete 84 births as mentioned above) and other is satyugi (Golden Aged) Krishna (who does take 84 births but not complete 84 births). It cannot be that the Murli is talking about only one Krishna who takes complete as well as incomplete 84 births. That is absurd. It is definitely not talking about only one soul here.

Also, soul of Brahma (Dada Lekhraj) left body in 1969. At present, he does not have his own body. He plays the role of a student in the body of Ram but does not have his own body. So, it cannot be said that He takes full 84 births because He is not playing the current part through his own body. His last birth (84th birth) ended in 1969. His 84 births have ended but the cycle has not completely ended yet. If he had taken complete 84 births, he should have been present in his own corporeal body till the end of the drama.

So, when it is said that Shri Krishna takes complete 84 births, it is referred to Samgamyugi Krishna and when it is said that Shri Krishna does not take complete 84 births, it referred to satyugi Krishna.